Duke's Place - A multipurpose Duke Ellington Thread

Duke Ellington is one of the greatest figures in Jazz and 20th century music, yet the information available within this forum is minimal and very vague. Quite a shame considering that his discography is vast, original and very good.

Where to start can be a problem; which songs and albums are the best and what are the differences between the different versions of songs and albums?

Which are the best albums? Hard to say, looking through various threads, a few seem to surface more frequently than others. The first that comes to mind would be Blues In Orbit, but why? Typically it's mentioned within a list with no supporting information. Is it the bluesy sax intro that hooks you on Three J's Blues, the quality of the new material or the reinvention of an old classic?

The saying "don't judge a book by it's cover" definitely applies to Duke Ellington. Just because the album has the same name or the song has the same name doesn't mean that it will be the same. A couple of examples:

The album Ellington Indigos was originally released in mono with 9 songs, yet the stereo version only has 8 (The Sky Fell Down was left off). Down the road there would be other changes to the track listing for the same album.

The Song Caravan, typically a showcase for Cootie Williams' muted trumpet, sounds very different and doesn't feature a trumpet at all on the albums Money Jungle and The Duke At Tanglewood.

To further complicate things, the sidemen often made albums under their own names. What are the good albums, who was cashing in, and did they revisit Duke Ellington classics?

I have been listening to his music for a few years and I am always amazed when I find an album that is better than what I had previously thought was his best. It's also cool when a song turns out to be a very different version than any other version that I have previously heard.

I have grown to love the music of Duke Ellington, and I am disappointed that I didn't discover him earlier. I honestly believe that if I had discovered him in my youth that he could have redefined my taste in music.

So... onto the purpose of this thread. An album by album or song by song thread would be cool but not possible. However, a multipurpose thread can work. What is your favorite album? Favorite song? Which version is the best? What sideman album is worthy of mention? There is a lot of good music by Duke Ellington but it is difficult to determine the best. All I ask for is a bit more than a top ten list or a title. What makes your choice your choice? Which version do you prefer?

 

Johnny Hodges

I first knowingly encountered Duke Ellington's music while searching for more tenor and alto sax related music = Johnny Hodges, and really enjoyed all that I heard, plus a number of songs sounded familiar and for good reason.

The All Star Road Band cds, Volumes 1 & 2, pulled me in and hearing/reading about some of the behind the scenes interplay it is fun to imagine Duke and his men as a sort of Grateful Dead of their day. The Three Suites cd was next and it's often been too hard to stop collecting more Duke. I wanted to like the music of Count Basie more, but Duke is tops.

 

You bring up some great points, especially the Grateful Dead tie in. Duke was around for 50 plus years (even longer if you count the years after his death) with members and guests coming and going. Jams of varying lengths and adaptations, it makes me wonder if they had a cult like following.

Another point that is interesting is the bit about Count Basie. It would make sense that I would be equally interested in Count Basie. I love First Time! The Count Meets The Duke, but the rest of the Count Basie albums that I've heard seem to lag way behind comparable Duke Ellington Efforts.

 

It always amazes me that Ellington's pre-war recordings are hardly discussed, let alone appreciated on this forum, maybe with the exception of the "Blanton/Webster Band" sides. What do people here think of the great Ellington recordings of the 1920s and 1930s?

As for Basie, comparing his recordings and Ellington's is comparing apples and oranges. About the only thing they have in common is that most of them are big-band sides. But this thread is about Ellington, so enough about Basie

 

Thanks for starting this thread, Matt. I, too, wish I had discovered Ellington's music earlier. I suppose I began to listen to his work seriously about the time of the centennary ten years ago - and to begin obsessively collecting from about 2002 or so. Whilst versed in the big bands, Sinatra, Nat Cole, I just didn't 'get' Ellington for about twenty years after I began collecting music. Once you do 'get' him though, nothing compares - I guess this is why Basie's band lags behind Ellington. He was unique.

I have more of a background in literature - none at all in music (can't read a note!) - so from that standpoint - and for all sorts of reasons - I would compare Ellington to Shakespeare - certainly so far as jazz is concerned. He is often referred to as the 'hot' Bach, a purveyor of what he termed 'gut bucket boleros' - and if his band can be compared to The Grateful Dead - well, that just shows the protean, inexhaustible depth of the music he created.

My point of entry was the aforementioned Blues in Orbitalbum - though that was a 'sleeper' for many years before the all consuming flame was ignited.

Hope this thread really gets off the ground. An album-by-album consideration would be difficult - particularly since Ellington's music, of course, pre-dates the album by about twenty-five years. Orbit is a great place to start - but I'm also particularly partial to Ellington Uptown and Masterpieces - his first two LPs ever (I think) - for Columbia - the perfect introduction and in hi-fi. The Blanton-Webster band ('40-42) is often cited as Ellington's creative peak. Maybe we can discuss the best sources for those recordings? Ellington at Fargo on Storyville from that period, too, is essential - and then as was said, the Road Band albums! Even after almost ten years of obsessive-compulsive collecting, I am no expert - but look forward to seeing this thread develop.

 

I was very lucky when I started collecting jazz back 30 years ago. French RCA started to issue a series called Double Black and White. The Ellington ones were as follows:-

1/2 - 1926-29
3/4 - 1930-34
5/6 - 1940
7/8 - 1941-42
9/10 -1940-46 (small groups)
10/11* -1944-46

* Don't ask me to explain the numbering...that's what the covers say.

All of these are worth searching out on vinyl. The 1940 one especially which is the Blanton-Webster band.

The other one that I bought back then which is really nice and has a relaxed feel is 'Unknown Session' made in 1960 and with a small group.

 

Those 2LP-sets were reissued on 2CD-sets, as follows:
1/2 - 1926-29
3/4 - 1930-34
5/6 - 1940
7/8 - 1941-42
9/10 -1940-46 (small groups)
11/12 -1944-46

 

Ian, have you heard Such Sweet Thunder? Music by Duke Ellington, inspired by William Shakespeare. There are 12 songs, all originals, that are very good. I really like the liner notes and their explanations. Songs as follows:

1. Such Sweet Thunder - Inspired by Othello - "The sweet and swinging, very convincing story Othello told Desdemona". Features the sweet talking trumpet of Ray Nance.
2. Sonnet For Caesar - first of four sonnets.
3. Sonnet To Hank Cinq - "The changes in tempo have to do with the changes of pace and the map as a result of wars".
4. Lady Mac - "Though she was a lady of noble birth, we suspect there was a little ragtime in her soul".
5. Sonnet In Search Of A Moor
6. The Telecasters - combines the three witches (three trombones) and Iago (Baritone Sax). "It seems that the three witches and Iago had something in common in that they all had something to say, so we call them the Telecasters".
7. Up And Down, Up And Down (I Will Lead Them Up And Down) - A piece describing Puck's maneuvers in A Midsummer Night's Dream.
8. Sonnet For Kate
9. Star-Crossed Lovers - "This is the sad story of two beautiful people". Johnny Hodges alto sax as Juliet and Paul Gonsalves tenor sax as Romeo.
10. Madness In Great Ones - Ellington's parallel to Hamlet's character during the time he was deceiving his stepfather.
11. Half the Fun
12. Circle Of Fourths - "Inspired by Shakespeare himself and the four major parts of his artistic contribution: tragedy, comedy, history and the sonnets".

 

Great idea for a thread.

I agree, it's very hard to stop collecting the Duke.
Just ordered a minty copy of the New Orleans Suite LP off ebay and I'm really looking forward to hearing some "new" Duke.

Recently I've rented a few Ellington dvds from the library. One with 2 sets from 1958 in Holland is excellent and the Love Him Madly doc that Ralph Gleason made in 1965 is also highly recommended.

Lately my go to discs have been the duets album with Ray Brown, "This one's for Blanton" and the Uptown reissue cd with Bellson's great Skin Deep drum showcase and the awesome "Take the A Train" with Betty Roche.

 

Hm think I was introduced to Duke - in a passionate way - by way of two coinciding listens: Duke's sessions with Louis Armstrong (the least known song, Azalea, remains among my favorite songs) and Alone With Three Giants by Marcus Roberts. Knew then I had to try more Duke, looked into some of Duke's recordings and have been a fan of his ever since.

 

I am not professing to be an expert on these records, but I have the big RCA-Centennial Box and I think that all these early sides are of very high quality. Indeed, I should listen to them more often. There is an almost overwhelming musicality to them. Wonderful amazing music. There is hardly anything better.

 

Don't forget the pre-war recordings that are now owned by Sony/Columbia. Hopefully the planned Mosaic set with Ellington's 1930s Columbia recordings will become reality.

I also have the big RCA Centennial box and musically it's great, though I am not so enthusiastic about the mastering, it's a bit too processed to my ears; that's why I also have the RCA "Jazz Tribune" 2CD-sets mentioned in my post #7.

 

I actually have one of the French (?) blue Columbia double LPs. I really would like to have all the Columbia Ellington stuff in a neat box, like they did with the Billie Holiday recordings. I know the mastering is not the greatest, but it is still wonderful music.

I have just pulled out the box and I put on disc 5. Just on a basis of my procession it sounds better than the Holiday-Columbia stuff.

 

Strangely - don't remember why - one of the first I picked up was The OKeh Ellington CDs. NoNoised and all, I love this often eerily creaky stuff. The early jazz vibe and musicianship is infectious, the arrangements and distinct character of many soloists wonderful, the music often imperishable. Fav tracks are the two wonderfully flowing and melodic (to my ears) tracks featuring Duke's solo piano Black Beauty and Swampy River, East St. Louis Toodle-oo (the first version, actually), What Can A Poor Fellow Do?, Take It Easy, The Blues With a Feelin', Goin' to Town, Misty Morning, Mississippi Moan, Hot and Bothered - well, you get the idea. The usual suspects too, The Mooche, Black & Tan Fantasy. Yes it might seem too ancient to some and the sound may not be what one would wish - getting all or even some of the original 78s probably isn't on my radar - but if the set looks like the best way to go for you too, better to have it and enjoy the music. You probably will.

 

I have hundreds of Ellington recordings, I truly hav loved his music for decades, and when I went to cd around 1988 I stared collecting Ellington cds and haven't stopped.

I'm very partial to the 'twenties and early 'thirties recordings on all the various labels. Just exciting and colorful composition and playing, nothing quite like it, it draws on New Orleans roots and all the influences of the music scene in New York City of the time. Excellent. . . . I wish that RCA would put otu a three or four cd set of their material, it seems to have been very well restored for the Centennial complete set and then. . .orphaned.

Bubber Miley, little talked of today, was a really interesting Ellingtonian trumpeter whose muted effects were distinctive and evocative. Ellington seemed to really be inspired to write for Bubber. Ellington also hired wonderful bassists and featured them often, had them recorded well, and as a result they became influential. Among my favorite Ellington bassists are Wellman Braud, Jimmie Blanton, Oscar Pettiford, Jimmy Woode and John Lamb. Charlie Mingus, one of my favorite musicians PERIOD, had a brief stint with Duke, a job that seemed to matter to Mingus the rest of his life.

Ellington had many amazing instrumentalists in his employ (most for decades!). One of my top favorites is trumpeter/violinist/singer Ray Nance. Ray took the Armstrong sound and vibe and made a special brew of his own. I can almost always identify his trumpet sound in a few notes. And I love his singing. On top of that, he was supposedly a great dancer. Tremendous work over more than three decades.

 

I sold that set when I got the (now OOP) French Masters of Jazz CDs with Ellington's 1920s/early 1930s recordings, but I agree that it's a must have for Ellington fans, despite the no-noised sound quality.

 

My only source of early Ellington is from the Franklin Mint set "The Greatest Jazz Recordings Of All Time". They dedicated 4 LPs (48 songs) to Duke Ellington and is mostly comprised of the 20's through the 40's. The set doesn't include everything, but I do like the chosen selections.

 

I'm partial to Ellington's later output which, oddly enough, is post-Strayhorn. I absolutely love the Far East Suite (with Strayhorn), the Latin American Suite, the Afro-Eurasian Eclipse and the New Orleans Suite. I realize his earlier work is classic, but it just doesn't do much for me.

 

I don't have any Ellington pre war recordings. I admit it is a big hole in my collection that needs to be filled someday.

One of his better later recordings is Far East Suite, from the late 60s. Another from that same era that often gets mentioned is ...and His Mother Called Him Bill, from 1967.

 

Lovely! Just as I clicked on the 'New Posts' button, 'Jack The Bear' started playing! After much hesitation, I recenty purchased the 2CD set Beyond Category - The Musical Genius of Duke Ellington (BMG), which was mastered by our host but was (ahem) 'disowned' because somebody used noise reduction on it post-mastering but pre-release. I've only got thirty-odd CDs of original recordings by DE and this compilation sounds better than most. Use of NR is noticeable but unobtrusive because the wonderful dynamics are still present. It certainly sounds much better than the fat-boy 3CD Blanton-Webster Band on the 3CD-in-cardboard Never No Lament.

Prior to acquiring Beyond Category, I delved into the Private Collections CDs that were released after the Duke's demise. Some are astounding, particularly the disc compiling the entire studio recordings of the Black, Brown and Beige suite, his masterpiece that was misunderstood when premiered live at Carnegie in '43.

Oh, by the way, I just do not like Ellington with vocalists. I absolutely detest them!

 

the recent vinyl reissue of The Nutcracker Suite mastered by our host and Kevin G. is really amazing, not the most essential Ellington thread, but certainly a holiday tradition around this house these past few years.

 

Ivie Anderson's not so bad

 

I love the early Ellington recordings. I am especially fond of "The Complete Brunswick and Vocalion Recordings 1926-1931". I have and enjoy the "Blanton/Webster" set as well even though Jack the Bear is pretty shrill sounding in parts. I have my eye on the two JSP Ellington sets, Vol. 1 1926-1929 and Vol. 2 1929-1940. Has anyone heard these before? I know some of the early JSP sets are great such as the Armstrong Hot Fives and Sevens set and the Jelly Roll Morton set but I haven't really heard anything regarding sound quality with the JSP sets.

 

I too like the pre-war recordings a great deal.

Before the "A" Train, Duke did another train song in 1933 called Daybreak Express which I like a lot as big band side.

Over the years, the absolute classic Ko-Ko from 1940 still excites me.

Looking forward to more recommendations from his catalog.

 

Count me as a fan of the pre-war sides, 'Creole Love Call' (1927), 'The Mooche' (1928), and 'Delta Serenade' and "Solitude' (1934). My five year old daughter often requests 'The Mooche' and was able to pick out the trumpet correctly, noting it sounded like a voice.

A very good sounding mono compilation is the Duke set from RCA Victor's This Is series, 2 lps, 20 songs, done well before n/r was common. Plentiful clean copies easy to find.

Also enjoy Stereo Reflections in Ellington that includes the below tracks from a 1932 session where two microphones recorded simultaneously onto two discs, and were combined into stereo for this issue. Arrestingly good sound. Also includes a good selection of Blanton-Webster band radio transcriptions.

1. Medley No. 1: Mood Indigo/Hot and Bothered/Creole Love Call
2. Medley No. 1: Hot and Bothered
3. Medley No. 1: Creole Love Call
4. Medley No. 2: East St. Louis Toodle-Oo
5. Medley No. 2: Lots o' Fingers
6. Medley No. 2: Black and Tan Fantasy