Scott's comments about this were actually posted earlier in the thread. Here's the post: Are CDs being phased out intentionally?
The latest report is of increased sales for vinyl and CDs, which I personally think is good news. It seems many people still like the physical product. Rather surprised many young people are buying vinyl albums, as I thought they would regard them as antiquated!
You are correct. Not one of the 20 somethings I work with listen to vinyl; it’s all Spotify and digital downloads. Not one of the folks my age realizes they have been producing new vinyl now for quite some time. I am literally the only one at my place of employment who collects and plays vinyl. I’m up in Canada mind, but the trend in NA is the same throughout.
Yes, you are correct. Although, that quote was not directly posted here by Scott himself. I was directly responding to the implication that I was fabricating anything, i.e., "some people are saying..."
Yes, I know Scott didn't post that here directly. But I thought it would be good to point it out for anyone who may not have seen it there already. It helps show that you're not making things up, but it's also good info on its own merits.
I wasn't implying that anyone was making things up, but for a long time people have been alleging that CDs are deliberately being suppressed in favor of vinyl, as if it were some conspiracy, and I don't think that's what's happening. As for what Scott reports, I certainly don't believe that he is making things up but whatever the reasons are for their refusing his request for CD reissues, they must be rooted in the bottom line and not some agenda to push vinyl LPs. Now I don't know what the relationship is between the majors and reissue labels like Rubellan - I don't know what he has to pay them or what percentage of sales they get - but they either must believe that they're not going to earn enough back to make it worth their while, or they just don't understand the demand for what Scott does. I'm certain that Rubellan doesn't manufacture thousands of CDs to sit in a warehouse. And it probably is a stupid reason why they're not playing ball - someone may just be looking at the general trajectory of CD sales in the US over the last twenty years and not considering Rubellan's own sales stats, which I'm sure are healthy. But I have a hard time believing that there is a concerted effort to kill the CD in favor of vinyl. Both formats are a tiny portion of the music market - it's not like if they kill the CD, it'll make LP sales soar to the stars.
I've gotta say that in an earlier post, you appeared to imply that some were gullible for believing what "some people have said...". Unless, of course, I misunderstood your point. Which maybe I did. But whether or not one believes that the industry is intentionally trying to kill CDs off, I agree with your last sentence. As enthusiasts of physical media, we're ALL kinda in the same boat here. CDs and LPs are both niche products now. And it doesn't matter how we got here. Neither side wins.
Does anyone think that the US having more disposable income contributes to the dominance of vinyl in physical sales
I was making tongue in cheek reference to a previous post in which another person alleged that higher sales of vinyl LPs in the US suggests that Americans are particularly gullible. And for many years, about the time that vinyl sales started closing in on CD for dollars, I've heard people allege that there was a secret agenda to kill the CD in favor of vinyl. Some have alleged that one of the reasons CD sales have fallen is because stores are stocking fewer CDs, which clearly puts the cart before the horse. If a person truly believes that Target is intentionally stocking fewer CDs in order to promote vinyl, I'd say that qualifies as gullible. What Scott posted is another thing entirely, and literally the only example I have ever heard of regarding record labels resisting CD reissues. Yes, we are all in the same boat in regard to physical media, and the continued perception of a vinyl vs CD war is something I find particularly frustrating, because it's so out of touch with reality.
Luminate 2023 report is out today. Some quotes from the Billboard summary: "Total U.S. album sales increased by 5.2% in 2023 to 105.32 million copies sold (up from 100.09 million in 2022). 2023 marked just the second year album sales increased in the last 10 years, following 2021. Album sales declined in every year from 2012-20, and again in 2022, as fans increasingly adopt streaming services as a means to consume music." "Total U.S. physical album sales (CD, vinyl LP, cassette, etc.) increased by 8.9% to 87 million in 2023 (up from 79.89 million in 2022). Digital album sales declined by 9.3% to 18.32 million in 2023 (down from 20.2 million in 2022)." "For the third consecutive year, and the third year since Luminate began tracking sales in 1991, vinyl albums outsold CD albums in the U.S. Vinyl once again is the leading configuration for album purchases for the third year in a row." "49.61 million vinyl albums were sold in 2023 (up 14.2% from 43.46 million in 2022). 2023 marked the 18th consecutive year vinyl album sales grew in the U.S., and the largest year for vinyl album sales since Luminate began tracking data in 1991. "36.83 million CD albums were sold in 2023 (up 2.7% compared to 35.87 million in 2022), making it the second-most popular configuration for album purchases." "The top 10-selling CD albums of 2023 are comprised entirely of releases by Swift and K-pop artists. " [Note: typically these had multiple variant covers so possibly the same consumers buying multiple copies of a title] "Swift also has five of the top 10-selling albums of 2023, five of the year’s top 10-selling vinyl albums and three of the top 10-selling CD albums. " Per Variety, Swift alone comprised 1.7% of the US recorded music market in 2023. "Total U.S. on-demand song streams (audio and video combined, inclusive of UGC streams) increased by 14.6% to 1.453 trillion in 2023 (up from 1.268 trillion in 2022). Yearly on-demand audio streams (again, inclusive of UGC) surpassed 1 trillion for a second time, with 1.249 trillion (up 12.7% from 1.108 trillion in 2022)."
Strange they don’t mention the self same thing occurs with vinyl with multiple coloured/picture disc pressings of the same album........
They didn't mention that, I did. But it holds for both. My point was that in those two categories -- Swift's titles and the K Pop titles, there were a lot of variants, but it's certainly true for both LP and CD.
Does anyone think that the US having more disposable income contributes to the dominance of vinyl in physical sales?
Went to my local Jbhifi to use some Christmas vouchers I received as presents. I prefer Metal and Hard Rock. A disturbing trend I've noticed lately is the shrinkage of the Metal sections across numerous outlets. The section in this particular store was that small it bordered on being a joke. I know physical product is suffering across the board but it seems like eventually the option of shopping for cds will soon disappear. For an old collector like myself it's sort of depressing.
Does anyone have proof that the US has more disposable income than say Japan or Germany where cd is the most dominant format by some margin?
"dominance" is probably too strong a descriptor. Per the recent Luminate data, there were 49.61M LPs sold in the US last year and 36.83M CDs, so around 35% more LPs than CDs, a health margin, but we're only talking about 13 million more LPs sold than CDs sold.
Well, it's probably a more nuance question than just looking at per capita income net of taxes, but based on that -- Disposable household and per capita income - Wikipedia
I don't think it's any more or less. I didn't really keep track of how many variant covers across CD and LP, as well as retailer-specific editions, Swift's re-recorded 1989 had, but presumably the hardcore Swift fans bought all of both. There were five versions and 12 covers of Stray Kids' 5-Star I think. Considering how much Swift and K Pop dominate physical media sales, variants has to be considered one of the biggest drivers in sales of physical media.
There’s at least 43 different vinyl variations of Hackney Diamonds. There’s around 30 vinyl variations of McCartney III, which admittedly came out 3 years ago, but they’re still churning them out.
And Hackney Diamonds still didn't make the top ten in vinyl or CD sales in the US last year. TOP 10-SELLING VINYL ALBUMS OF 2023 IN U.S. 1. Taylor Swift, 1989 (Taylor’s Version) (1.014 million) 2. Taylor Swift, Speak Now (Taylor’s Version) (510,000) 3. Taylor Swift, Midnights (492,000) 4. Travis Scott, Utopia (373,000) 5. Taylor Swift, Folklore (308,000) 6. Olivia Rodrigo, Guts (267,000) 7. Taylor Swift, Lover (256,000) 8. Lana Del Rey, Did You Know That There’s a Tunnel Under Ocean Blvd (215,000) 9. Fleetwood Mac, Rumours (206,000) 10. Lana Del Rey, Born to Die (192,000) Source: Luminate, for the tracking period Dec. 30, 2022, through Dec. 28, 2023 TOP 10-SELLING CD ALBUMS OF 2023 IN U.S. 1. Taylor Swift, 1989 (Taylor’s Version) (800,000) 2. Stray Kids, 5-STAR (520,000) 3. TOMORROW X TOGETHER, The Name Chapter: TEMPTATION (442,000) 4. Stray Kids, ROCK-STAR (381,000) 5. NewJeans, 2nd EP Get Up (332,000) 6. TWICE, Ready to Be (303,000) 7. SEVENTEEN, SEVENTEEN 10th Mini Album Fml (288,000) 8. Taylor Swift, Midnights (276,000) 9. Taylor Swift, Speak Now (Taylor’s Version) (267,000) 10. Jung Kook, Golden (244,000) Source: Luminate, for the tracking period Dec. 30, 2022, through Dec. 28, 2023.
My, you girls are sure lookin' nice tonight (Thanks, Dan!) Yeah, you remind me of a girl who lives in my apartment complex (Oh, yeah?) Really, I don't know where she does her shoppin', but man, what style She's a bit old-timey, but that's alright with me She wears a dress of velvet that hangs below her knees, her knees She's a bit old-fashioned, as all the world can see The cameo she wears upon her bosom, puts me in ecstasy, ecstasy Yes, she's her own grandmother, that's what they're telling me But my old-timey baby is swell enough for me, you see You see, she plays her old Victrola The lamp is low, kerosene, you know You know we lie, we lie upon her bed The patchwork quilt beneath her head (Her wheel is spinning, spinning) or while her wheel is spinning She sews some lace or we embrace Or when we go out strolling, the world can plainly see (That my old-timey baby is swell (she's swell) enough, she's young (she's young) enough She's hip enough for me (Dan Hicks, "My Old Timey Baby")
Are there any stats on how the release of special, collectible items compares numerically (vinyl vs. CDs)? In other words, how much product is being snatched up because it's a one-time collectible release? That could drive sales toward one format or the other. (I'm wondering about more than Swift and K-pop here.)
