The Smiths - Complete box set coming from Rhino in October (part2)

So they're saying that Amazon opened their product, removed the cards, re-wrapped them with a new sticker on them that no longer included the download verbiage, and then sent them out to the customers?

Yeah, that makes sense.

 

I have read this thread with much interest, and I feel the pain of those of you who have gotten damaged boxes, missing download cards, etc.

The sad truth is that we may think of Rhino as a "record company," but in reality it's probably down to two or three frantic workers in an office trying to keep the ship afloat. From the major labels on down, the music industry is a shadow of its former self, and unfortunately, customer service and quality control always suffer in such an environment. I think your only real hope for satisfaction would come from amazon, as they're still a major player.

 

Well, that's true... but how or why would Amazon even HAVE the download cards to replace? They didn't make the box... Rhino did!

 

Yeah, I didn't mean amazon could get the download card for you, I just meant that you're way more likely to get a return or refund from amazon... but then again, that would be a major defeat in itself.

The state of the music industry is really depressing. It's like the labels are making a last-ditch effort to make money with these lavish box sets, and yet there always seems to be some sort of epic fail involved once the set is released.

 

This set is not perfect, but few things are. I'd hardly describe it as an"epic fail," though. I'm quite happy with what I got. They could press the records out of diamonds, the CDs out of gold, and include BluRay, DVD-A, and 8-track versions of all the albums and people would still find something to bitch about.

 

Maybe not an "epic fail," but whenever you pay upwards of $100 for something and it doesn't deliver what was promised, that's not good. It's probably not as disturbing for those who got a good deal on the box from amazon.ca, but if I paid the asking price of $250 (or whatever it is) for this and didn't get the download card (or anything else that was supposed to come in the box), I'd be pissed just as a matter of principle.

 

You raise my next point, which is the schizophrenic nature of fans' demands with regard to this set: everyone wants to score it for $150, or whatever mistake price Amazon.ca, was offering it for, then they complain it isn't high-quality enough. People literally want something for nothing. $250 for eleven LPs, eight CDs, and twenty-five 7" singles is hardly extortionate, but, no, people have to have all that stuff for $150, and then complain about it. On the issue of the download codes, if they were advertised, they should have been included, but it's not like physical pieces of the box were missing. Everyone here is always whining about how terrible downloads are and how they want physical media and packaging and all that, and then they get a beautifully packaged box of physical media for a bargain price and then turn around and moan about no downloads. I gave my download code away because I've got the CDs and understand how to rip them to iTunes at the quality level I prefer. Yes, I'm aware that there are some tracks exclusive to the 7" singles and to the download code, and I feel bad for those who have no way to needledrop the singles, but I also kind of have to wonder who would pay hundreds of dollars to get a comprehensive physical media set like this and be primarily concerned about the downloads.

But if we want record companies to stay in business and produce the kind of high-quality physical media box sets we demand, we are ultimately going to have to pay for that level of quality. The feeding frenzy for Amazon.ca's super deal on this set was great for those who got the super deal, but it's not a sustainable business model for Rhino to do more sets like this one in the future.

 

I'm sure not to us lot, but to SOME people who bought this box out in the non-audiophile community, I'm sure the missing download card is, in fact, a really big deal. Guessing that a healthy majority of those same people don't even know what "needledrop" means, let alone have the means to do it.

Also, as far as being "comprehensive" -- I think that's the ONE and ONLY legit complaint about this set. There's a couple dozen legitimately released tracks that aren't here in any form.

 

Guys if you are missing the download card and it was meant to come with your purchase why not just google the set and download it. It's yours and you'll probably get it in FLAC as well lols.

 

No response yet...

 

These are all excellent points and I agree. The "deal" from amazon Canada was really a mistake, and people benefited from it. I certainly think the set is worth way more than the $150 people paid.

And, I also agree that the download code doesn't add anything substantial to the overall monetary value of the set. Like you, I doubt anyone ordered this set primarly for the stupid downloads. But if you pay big bucks for the set, it should include everything without you having to jump through a bunch of hoops or wait in limbo to see if you're going to get whatever was missing.

My larger point, though, is that box sets keep getting bigger and more lavish, and yet the companies that produce them are getting smaller and smaller all the time. Quality control and customer service are going to suffer in that environment.

 

Hi folks, there was a copy of the complete set at Soundscapes in Toronto on College street on Sunday evening for 549.99. It was most likely the last one in the city. I was tempted but I'm not that huge a Smiths fan and 550 is a lot. But, if you are a TO guy who reads this and wants one I'd give them a call ASAP...you might get lucky

 

Just because I snapped up a bargain on Amazon.ca doesn't mean my expectations should be any lower than the person who pays $650 for the set from JB Hi-Fi.

 

Perfect example of the entitlement mentality I was talking about. The bargain that people snapped up on Amazon.ca was like the bargains people snapped up when the Beatles' Apple clothing store was going out of business - it's great fun to score something nice for nothing or next-to-nothing as a business collapses, but I don't think anyone who scored some free clothes when the Apple boutique was going out of business had any reasonable expectation of there being nice new clothes to buy there in 1969, and people who snapped up this bargain on Amazon.ca don't have any reasonable expectation of there being more sets like this coming down the pike from Rhino in 2013. I don't think that the Record Company Fairy and the Pressing Plant Fairy produced all seventeen pounds of physical product of this set out of thin air, and, when those seventeen pounds of physical product are being sold for $150 plus Free Super Saver Shipping, someone is losing money on the deal. Maybe Amazon can afford to lose money longer than Rhino can, but neither one of them is going to lose money forever. So enjoy your sweet deal that you snapped up, and complain about your missing downloads (that are in the crappy mp3 quality that we also love to complain about), but don't come crying to me when there are no more record companies to produce box sets like this to snap up at below-cost prices.

 

I'm thinking that the download card was regional, but it's something that Rhino probably should make clear so there's no confusion, regardless of where you bought it and how much you paid. If you go to Rhino.com (US site?) there's no mention of a download card / code, but on Rhino.uk it's clearly stated. Strange that it would even be different between them, but it is what it is.

If someone bought the boxed set on Rhino.uk with the expectation of a code and didn't get it, I would recommend contacting them as it's something they did advertise. But for the rest of us, I don't see any evidence that it was advertised.

 

There are always differences between the usa and euro releases... being the euro ones far better...

 

But what's weird is that this is a limited edition, and originated from the EU (mine even lists rhino.co.uk on the shrink) - so tmk the packaging itself is not broken up by region. Even the DVD itself is Region 0 (accessible on any DVD player, regardless of what country you're in).

Not that it matters to me much - I didn't really need a download card and am very happy that I got what I did, at the price I did. But it's just a bit of a mystery on how they separated things this way - was it intentional? Or was it just an oversight on certain boxes? I honestly have no idea.

Btw, this is the ad I was talking about: http://www.rhino.co.uk/thesmithscomplete

 

I don't think crimpies quote is evident of an entitlement mentality. To me, an entitlement mentality would be: "I deserve to be able to purchase this $350-500 boxset for $150 and how dare they not sell it to me for that price." Or having hoped for a bargain on what clearly seemed to be a misprice, one acts outraged if the order does not get fulfilled. While I took advantage of the Amazon.ca deal, I really did not expect it to be fulfilled and certainly was not going to complain if I had received an email from Amazon explaining that the price was a mistake and telling me they could not fulfill at that price. To have then argued with them I think would be a clear case of entitlement.

I don't think asking for what you paid for (even if you paid a discounted price, so long as the item was advertised as new) is wrong or acting entitled. That said, given the deal I received I would not have complained even had I not received a download code (and even though it is actually valuable to me as someone who does not have a turntable). But that is me and I cannot blame someone for wanting the download code IF it was advertised (which I do not believe it was in the states at least).

While I don't necessarily agree with your entitlement critique, I do think some people need to chill and keep some perspective. Especially for those who got the Amazon.ca deal, maybe we should be appreciative and not fault minor dings in packaging resulting from poor packaging. Nobody likes damaged goods, but unless there are serious flaws, that is just part of buying online (and frankly retail in general).

 

A couple of dozen? It's only a couple isn't it, not counting mix variations.

 

Well, counting everything -- live tracks, mix variations, etc. -- as well as standard tracks like "Jeane", it is definitely a couple dozen at least.

In any case, these tracks weren't (for the most part) posthumous things -- they were part of the band's original catalog. Why they issued a "complete" box set without it actually being "complete" seems to be the chief complaint that we can all agree on.

 

Copied from post 461 in the previous part of the thread -- I've highlighted the three songs that are missing entirely from the set, but as you can see, there are a LOT of b-sides from the orignal 12" singles and the like that aren't included:

Previously released studio/alternate

Wonderful Woman - This Charming Man 12"
This Charming Man (London) - This Charming Man CD Single 2, 1992
This Charming Man (New York Vocal) - This Charming Man CD Single 2, 1992
This Charming Man (New York Instrumental) - This Charming Man CD Single 2, 1992
This Charming Man (Single Remix) - This Charming Man CD Single 2, 1992
Jeane - Sandie Shaw 12"
Hand In Glove (rare alternate mix - Sandie Shaw) - The Smiths (Tokuma Japan 35JC-102, September 1984)
Heaven Knows I'm Miserable Now (12" extended mix)
How Soon Is Now? (withdrawn alternate mix) "William, It Was Really Nothing" (Italy, Virgin VINX71 12" single, 1984)
Barbarism Begins At Home (7"edit)
How Soon Is Now? (USA 7" Phil Brown edit)
The Headmaster Ritual (USA 7" Phil Brown edit) (7" #9 in set?)
Rubber Ring/Asleep (12 " Version) - The Boy with the Thorn in His Side 12"
Work Is a Four-Letter Word (12" Version) - Girlfriend in a Coma 12"
Nowhere Fast (John Peel session version) - Last Night I Dreamt That Somebody Loved Me CD
William, It Was Really Nothing" (John Peel session version) - Last Night I Dreamt That Somebody Loved Me CD
Miserable Lie (Peel session 31/5/83) - The Peel Sessions EP

Previously released live

Hand In Glove (live at Brixton Ace 29 June 1983) - "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out" CD1, 1992
Girl Afraid (live in Glasgow 2 March 1984) - NME Department of Enjoyment cassette (NME011, 1985)
Nowhere Fast (Live Oxford 18/3/85) - That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore 12"
Stretch Out and Wait (Live Oxford 18/3/85) - That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore 12"
Shakespeare's Sister (Live Oxford 18/3/85) - That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore 12"
Some Girls Are Bigger Than Others (Live London 12/12/86) - I Started Something I Couldn't Finish 12"
What's the World (Live Glasgow 25/9/85) - I Started Something I Couldn't Finish Cassette
What She Said (live on 18 March 1985 at the Oxford Apollo) - NME Poll Winners [UK NME, 7": GIV1]
Miserable Lie (Live on Oxford Apollo on 18 March 1985) - Rough Trade Compilation Canada Rough Trade, LP: RTS1986

 

Amazon is losing money? Since when?!

Your point here seems a bit misguided though... on the one hand, the pricing issue was all Amazon's fault. So who lost the money? AMAZON, right? Not Rhino -- they got paid regardless. So how is the record company suffering here to the point where they aren't going to make these boxes anymore? They got paid! Your logic here is acting against itself.

I understand you not liking the mealy-mouthed complaining of people who get the bargain of a lifetime (I don't either), but your argument above is simply contradictory to itself.

 

Jeane is in the box on the 7"
Much of the other stuff is live versions or all those versions of TCM, which I can live without, and are on the Cd singles box anyway.
Perhaps the other rare stuff needed approval from Morrissey?

Whatever, it was probably a mistake to call it The Complete but what we have, the package, is brilliant and enough I think.

 

Hello Christian,

The download code/card that you are talking about is not offered on the Rhino site.
You will have to get in contact with Amazon to be able to address this issue.

Sincerely,
David R.
Rhino.com Customer Service

 

Not the Sandie Shaw version.