The Rush cd mastering thread

Confirmed. It completely matches up with the Atomic WG Signals. Another mystery solved.

 

Argh, you just had to throw in a nearly-impossible-to-obtain CD in there too eh?

 

I will briefly comment on two of these...I know this isn't the thread to do so. The MoFi Crime of the Century CD is one of the worst versions I've ever heard. When I listened to it, I was shocked by all the great things I heard about it. Plus there are instances where the percussion is somehow over EQed. (IE: WAY WAY too loud) I really tried to like this CD and briefly fooled myself in to thinking I did but could not. (You can read my comments in the COTS thread) The Mofi COTS vinyl has no issues at all, except to say it's a little brighter than the slightly superior Speakers Corner version.

I will concur that Songs From the Big Chair sounds good...I forgot all about that one BUT (and this is why I might have forgotten) the song Shout is the oddball out. It's VERY LOUD compared to the others. The West German Atomic of Shout sounds so much better.

Anyway, despite possible replies, I'll leave my comments here.

 

LOL I missed your contribution to this thread http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showpost.php?p=3812687&postcount=128

Anyway, we like what we like but the MP MOFI is a fine disc and certainly isn't tweaked. Anyone comparing copies should try it if they can and crank it.

 

This is how I think of it too. I do like the Blind Faith MFSL, and Tommy is pretty good, but overall for the ones that I've heard, not much of a fan. (The 2 Cream Live MFSL discs? Awful, IMO.)

So for that reason, and the current prices for a lot of them, I don't try to backfill my collection with ones that I don't already have. Never had or heard the MFSL for Moving Pictures, for example.

And I do like the MFSL for Signals, not because it's the best sounding, but just because it's different than the Atomic and Anthem.

 

I think the MFSL CD's of Moving Pictures and Signals are fantastic. I also like the MFSL of Permanent Waves, though not as much as the former two. The MFSL of 2112 is too harsh in many ways, but I dont dislike it as much as some on here do.

 

Well that's good to know - thanks for helping me sort that out! I suppose the last thing some people here need is another unique version of Signals to acquire and dissect after the case has more or less been closed on that album.

So it's just some weird misprint then. Perhaps I should look into selling it if it's such an oddity. Anyone know of a good site (besides eBay) where they buy/sell rare CDs? (Plus I'm looking to possibly pick up a few Anthems, and trying to figure that out from eBay sellers is difficult.)

 

You can sell it here actually. I'm not sure of the forum though.

 

I can provide samples if you want.

Have you heard the SHM of Signals yet? I have to agree with Fizbin that's it's probably the best.

 

That's exactly how I hear them. With PW! I definitely prefer the atomic but the MOFI is not bad just brighter. The 2112 MOFI is harsh, I like my Japan disc for that but the album is not as well recorded as the other two.

Just so it's not left out, I think the Atomic of AFTK is great and haven't bothered to look elsewhere.

 

From what you were saying I thought you had heard the MP. I think you would find it interesting especially if you like your Rush cranked up. The only thing against it is cost these days, particularly because the atomic is so cheap but if it's a fav album......

 

OK, I'll PM you about this too.

I have the AMCY which is the same as the SHM. I do have every Signals CD, and it's been on my list to compare again, in that I just got the 25-8P so I can listen casually as well as the quick A/B of a track or two, but I just haven't gotten to it yet.

I'm kind of lazy, and it's super easy to compare 2 different discs, but you throw a 3rd and 4th in there, and for me to do a proper comparison takes a lot more time and sometimes I just keep putting it off ...

 

Arent there two different AMCY's? I thought one was a clone of the 97 remaster? I have an AMCY (291), which I believe is NOT the clone. Is this the one you say is the same as the SHM? I havent listened to it in a while, but I remember not liking it as much as the 25.8P or the Mofi. I'm not saying I remember it as bad, quite the contrary, but I remember it being brighter than the other two I just mentioned, and I actually like my CD's a tad brighter than most.

 

While I'm on the subject of thr AMCY CD (not the 97 remaster clone), I noticed that some stated on this thread that the AMCY-291 shared the same mastering with the 25.8P. I put both through EAC and they had very different peak values. Does this prove that they are NOT the same mastering? They certainly sound different to me. I'm comparing all of my Signals CD's right now (97 remaster, MFSL, AMCY 291, 25.8P).

 

OK...trying to keep this thread going tonight. Can those that prefer the AMCY of Signals tell me why that's so? Just curious to know while I sit here and listen to all of my copies of the album.

 

Sounds like you have the remaster. The SHM I've heard is not bright at all, especially when put in perspective with "bright" Rush albums like Power Windows.

I don't recall this statement being made anywhere in the thread. The only mastering sharing going on with the AMCY (non-remastered) is the SHM.

Fizbin stated something to the extent of "every track is sonically superior", while later mentioning that the 25.8P is very close and is basically a near equal choice for best listen-ability. I've not heard the 25.8P, so I can't comment on that version. The MOFI was criticized for having the missing lyric in "The Weapon" as well as having inconsistent superiority over other versions in terms of individual songs. For example, the MOFI "Subdivisions" is pretty mediocre compared to the Anthem.

 

There are two AMCY catalog numbers for every (?) disc. The remasters have the higher number, and are inferior. I rarely mention the '97 remasters in this thread, because none of them IMO are worth having.

For Signals, the good AMCY is indeed 291, but I can't remember if it's a clone, or a level shifted version.

The ACMY is brighter than the WANK, and so is the 25-8P, but I tended to like the AMCY more than the 25-8P because it also has a smidge more low end which helps to balance out the highs. But my fave for this one is so far still the old Anthems, along with the MFSL because it's "different".

OK, finally got a chance to compare Dave's sample:



Looks to be the same or very similar. The straight line is a little noisy, but Dave posted a 65s sample, and I'm finding the noise does decrease some with a longer sample. (Audacity's limit is about 4 min for the freq spectra export feature.)

So at least so far, I think all the ANC-1's are the same as the ANK/VANK/WANK's.

 

Hey Kevin, any news on the ANC versus WANK comparison?

Cheers

Ged

 

Ahhh, it's right above your post.

 

I must say, I've thoroughly enjoyed this thread - like many other threads (eg Sabbath, Iron Maiden, Kiss, AC/DC, Floyd and my guilty pleasure, Abba, to name a few) it has pointed me in the right direction(s) to seek out those great sounding discs.

Can't say I understand some of the technical stuff (graphs and waves etc) which is why I don't tend to contribute much (always been more of a watcher than a do-er!) but has given me some great pointers.

Cheers chaps, and keep it up

 

I've got the silverface for 2112 and agree with others here that it's too bright. Sounds like the Anthem, 25 8P, and AMCY are all slightly less-bright, but I was wondering about the vinyl. Does anyone know how the vinyl version of 2112 compares to the silverface and if it's worth finding?

 

I think this is the only Rush title me and Kevin have a -slight- disagreement. I liked the Anthem Signals when I first got it (it was my first to compare with the '97 remaster so how could I not?) but now I find it too soft and the balance on the first four tracks is centered SLIGHTLY more on the left side.

I'm hearing more than just better bass on the AMCY...I hear better sound-stage and better clarity. Actually the bass on the US vinyl pressing is even better and more natural sounding. By comparison the bass on the AMCY/SHM-CD sounds artificial.

 

I know I'm jumping ahead here, but I've already come to a conclusion on Counterparts: Vinyl, vinyl, vinyl.

The CD just has no space at all and appears to be compressed and brickwalled (to an extent, and this is pre-remaster, woe to he who has that). Whether there is limiting, I have no idea, but looking at the waveform I think I see some clipped peaks on some songs. By comparison, the Counterparts vinyl I've examined has space, and is much more dynamic (I get "DR" readings of 10-11 vs. the cd's 8-9). The vinyl is much closer to the mastering practices of Rush's 80s (and earlier) albums. The CD jumps to the flawed practices of the 1997 Remasters and Test For Echo.

And this applies to all CP cds, be it AMCY, Atlantic, or Anthem.

 

Finally got a chance to look at Force Ten from Hold Your Fire:



The VANK I have is the same as the samples posted for the AMCY and Mercury (Atomic?). (Can't see the Mercury as it's directly "underneath" the AMCY - VANK in the graph.) The SHM is different (but looks to be from the same digital source as the others). The SHM has a slightly rolled off high end that to me does improve things. I think it's interesting that the old remaster boosted the low end in an attempt to better "balance" the hot high end. (The dynamics are too mooshed anyway for the remaster.) Anyway, I like the SHM the best for this one now.

AccurateRip confirmed for the VANK.