The Concert Sinatra on Reprise from 1963 (including discussion of remixed Concord CD release)*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by thomh, Jan 28, 2003.

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  1. hodgo

    hodgo Tea Making Gort (Yorkshire Branch) Staff

    Location:
    East Yorkshire
    I think I'll stick to my pristine mono first pressing.
     
    hodgo, Nov 23, 2011
    #26
    Pieter Kozak likes this.
  2. montejay

    montejay Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ontario Canada
    montejay, Nov 23, 2011
    #27
  3. Sean Keane

    Sean Keane Pre-Mono record collector In Memoriam

    Location:
    The island of Montreal
    Did the original CD use the half inch three track tape, or will this be the first time the CD be sourced from this tape?
     
    Sean Keane, Nov 23, 2011
    #28
  4. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    I believe the "original" CD (1987) used the 2-track stereo mix from back in the day.

    The "Entertainer of the Century" reissue CD (1999) was a new remix from the 3-track tapes. So to answer the question: No, this will not be the first time.
     
    Bob F, Nov 23, 2011
    #29
  5. bartels76

    bartels76 Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    CT
    I haven't bought any of these Concord releases yet because I have the Reprise 20 CD box. This may make me bite as I love this album.
     
    bartels76, Nov 23, 2011
    #30
  6. Ronald Sarbo

    Ronald Sarbo Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY, NY, USA
    There is a rumor that Concord will issue this on LP. They recently did a vinyl edition of Ray Charles' "Modern Sounds In Country And Western Music".
     
    Ronald Sarbo, Nov 24, 2011
    #31
  7. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    There is also an unofficial report that there will be a "super high material alternate version" [SHM]. I don't know if this means just a version for the Japanese market (like almost all SHM-CD releases), and/or a different mastering.
     
    Bob F, Nov 25, 2011
    #32
  8. andy75

    andy75 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sweden
    This is a must buy. I already own the remaster of this title, but the older Concord releases have been so good, that there's no doubt in my mind that this will be equal :). I hope "Cycles" gets this treatment aswell!
     
    andy75, Nov 25, 2011
    #33
  9. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Not a mixup with the current Mobile Fidelity issue?
     
    MMM, Nov 25, 2011
    #34
  10. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Sorry for posting unconfirmed information. I now believe that report may be based on the current Amazon.com product description, in which case it is totally false. Amazon is showing the description of the Universal Music Japan CD issue from two years ago.
     
    Bob F, Nov 25, 2011
    #35
  11. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    It begins to look like this new CD release will in fact be remixed from the original 35mm mags. From a just-published interview with Frank Jr.:

    Frank Sinatra, Jr. Reveals His Father's Grounded Side, Pays Tribute With 'Best of the Best' - Spinner

     
    Bob F, Nov 30, 2011
    #36
  12. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Well, here's hoping...again....

    Matt
     
    MLutthans, Nov 30, 2011
    #37
  13. rangerjohn

    rangerjohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    chicago, il

    :righton:


    Thanks for pointing that out, Bob.
     
    rangerjohn, Dec 1, 2011
    #38
  14. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Bob F, Dec 2, 2011
    #39
  15. fortherecord

    fortherecord Senior Member

    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    I wish they would get hip to it and issue both mono and stereo mixes for the Sinatra catalogue. That would be something new.
     
    fortherecord, Dec 2, 2011
    #40
  16. apileocole

    apileocole Lush Life Gort

    Location:
    San Luis Obispo California
    Thanks Bob (and Frank, Jr.!) for the interesting update. This release is sounding more exciting now.

    If I understand the situation well enough, assembling and mixing in the digital domain may be facilitating a sync and mix that would be darn near if not impossible to do otherwise or to have done some years ago. Of course the actual quality of sound we're going to get on the final release remains to be heard...
     
    apileocole, Dec 2, 2011
    #41
  17. hodgo

    hodgo Tea Making Gort (Yorkshire Branch) Staff

    Location:
    East Yorkshire
    Yes my interest is growing if indeed this has be done from the mag tapes, though I'll wait for reviews here before buying.
     
    hodgo, Dec 2, 2011
    #42
  18. rangerjohn

    rangerjohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    chicago, il
    If Walsh (whom I presume is remixing this) treats the vocals like he did on RDD! and Sinatra-Basie (muted, muffled) then this will be a disappointment.

    The bands sound great on those releases but the vocals are off. I don't know why he doesn't model these new mixes on his 80s Capitol mixes--the voice generally sounded great on those. What's the point of presenting the vocals with less reverb if you're going to make them sound more remote?
     
    rangerjohn, Dec 2, 2011
    #43
  19. John DeAngelis

    John DeAngelis Senior Member

    Location:
    New York, NY
    Thanks for the link to the interview with Frank Jr., Bob.
     
    John DeAngelis, Dec 2, 2011
    #44
  20. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    I'm very eager for the CD release, and I really hope they get this one right.

    Are there any known vocal overdubs on this album? There's something fishy on "Lost in the Stars." (I'm listening tonight on a scowling Frank original stereo LP, if that matters.) Parts of it sound all United/Putnamy/knob-twiddly, not Goldwyn/soundstagy/yummy (by comparison).

    (Maybe this has already been discussed somewhere???? Sorry if I'm re-hashing.)

    Matt

    Edit: Here's a rundown of what I'm hearing, and I'm using LP timings, so they may be off a bit from the CD.

    0:37 -- right in the middle of those atmospheric flute/clarinet arpeggios, there's a splice that totally shifts the stereo image, abruptly. This is all before FS enters.

    Frank comes in, and that Church mic shown on the cover sounds fabulous -- so much better than the sound over at United.

    1:13 to 2:48 -- "Then the Lord God hunted...." through to "and the word He'd say." I could swear that's "The United Sound" on the vocal all of a sudden: boxy, two-dimensional, somewhat tinny, odd high end, blech.

    2:48 to 2:58 -- "And we're lost out here in the stars, little stars" - Goldwyn's Church mic again. Gorgeous.

    2:58 to 3:33 -- Back to the box.

    3:33 to 4:04 -- Goldwyn again.

    Sounds overdubby to me! At bare minimum, these are edits from different takes, but that vocal tone smells like teen Putnam, IMO.

    ??????????????????????????

    (My Heart Stood Still is no vocal-track picnic, either.)
     
    MLutthans, Dec 10, 2011
    #45
    steveinphilly and McLover like this.
  21. aoxomoxoa

    aoxomoxoa I'm an ear sitting in the sky

    Location:
    USA
    Matt
    I pulled out my mono "Scowling Frank" this morning. I don't hear what you hear on "Lost In The Stars". But I am listening at a lower volume so I won't wake everyone in the house.

    This album is becoming one of my favorites. I really enjoy the Mofi. I am looking forward to this remixed cd!
     
    aoxomoxoa, Dec 10, 2011
    #46
  22. apileocole

    apileocole Lush Life Gort

    Location:
    San Luis Obispo California
    I hear it, Matt (on the suitcase). But I don't know if it's a matter of editing between (an unknown number of) different takes that were perhaps mic'd or mixed a bit differently or later overdubbing.

    Maybe the mono is different.

    For what it's worth (nothin'!) I think I'd tend to prefer to hear Frank doing just one take through in most cases and not dice the flow for "better" bits here and there. Maybe we'll be hearing a partially different performance this time...
     
    apileocole, Dec 10, 2011
    #47
    MLutthans likes this.
  23. rangerjohn

    rangerjohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    chicago, il
    Great analysis, as always, Matt. I hope that most of the other tracks are free of intercuts. I've never noticed any, but wasn't looking for them.

    I look forward to full-scale comparisons on your site when the Concord CD comes out. Do you have a mono LP for comparative purposes? Many folks around here, in addition to aoxomoxoa, have mentioned that they prefer the mono version.
     
    rangerjohn, Dec 10, 2011
    #48
  24. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    I really enjoyed the MFSL reissue LP of this title.
     
    LeeS, Dec 10, 2011
    #49
  25. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    I only recently picked up original mono and stereo LPs (I bought the CD when it came out in the 80s), and I can see why aoxomoxoa likes the mono, which strikes me as being quite nice. (The stereo LP is good, too.)

    Matt
     
    MLutthans, Dec 10, 2011
    #50
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