Red Hot Chili Peppers "Stadium" on LP getting closer to being released, look at this.

Well, the thing is, even if I bought a turntable, I'd get minimal use out of it, as a lot of the music I listen to isn't available on LP and if it is, it costs a lot more than the CD and doesn't sound any different.

 

Steve, thanks again for 'civilizing' music.

I wish Keane would have opted for a dynamic range such as that of this LP on their most recent work, "Under The Iron Sea." No need to post a wav file graphic the RHCP CD is exactly like 99% of this Keane CD. Don't the artists realize that it destroys the feeling/expression in their own music? Funny thing, the demo recordings of the songs on the new Keane album sound better, volume and dynamics wise, than the final CD.

BTW, as I mentioned before, now we need HiRez 96/24 (or more) disks of Steve's mastering. Is someone from Warner listening?

 

After we buy the LPs, needle drops to follow.

Thanks Steve and Kevin!

 

Actually, Steve does master directly from the master tapes. But to expand on OcdMan's answer, The RIAA is applied "in-line" between the playback console and the cutting head. I think it's actually part of the lathe's audio circuit, but Steve or someone else who knows this will have to confirm that.

There is no "RIAA-applied tape".

Now, there have been cases where an "LP master" copy was made, but that was usually to apply some specific eq'ing. But this had nothing to do with the RIAA curve.

 

Or a HiRez version of the album as Warner has done with Neil Youngs latest albums and Donald Fagen.

 

Due to the interest this new mastering of "Stadium Arcadium" it wouldn't surprise me if suddenly a needle drop 'appeared' on the Internet if Warner does not announce a HiRez version of it.

Unfortunately, I am one of those who doesn't have a working turntable and is not planning to purchase one. I am not a fan of this band, but I would purchase Steve's mastering of this album if available in HiRez.

 

Thank you for sharing that photo Steve. Brought a smile to my face -- can't wait to hear it! New turntable, here I come!

 

Given lectures I have received about even discussing file sharing or CD-Rs in the past, I find all of this open talk about "Don't worry, we'll just needledrop Steve's mastering and put it on the net" and "Where can I get the unmastered bootleg Californication?" to be bizarre.

Are you kidding me? Why not just post: "I'll be giving Steve and the Chili Peppers' work away for free to everyone who doesn't have a turntable."

You want to support good mastering? Take $300 that you were going to waste on maximized CDs and buy an entry level turntable and a copy of Steve's Stadium Arcadium on vinyl.

All some people do here is bitch and moan about how bad modern CDs sound, but they keep on buying them, and refuse to consider proven superior alternatives such as vinyl.

 

Steve , I wish more artists cared about sound quality & would allow you to handle there mastering.

 

Well, I did buy Californication when it came out on CD, so I feel that I supported the band or whoever my money went to. I dont believe in dowloading music unless this is the case...or if I can somehow get unreleased songs or performances. But it is interesting that people could lagely alter mastering trends by getting into vinyl.

Its hard to put off getting that brand new album though! And how do you know its compressed terribly the first few days its out? Once again, its all about convenience with CDs. If they would start releasing vinyl at the same time as the CD...they'd have something.

Right now, it takes a good deal of patience to put off listening to your favorite band's new album, and waiting a couple months for the vinyl. Thats the case with me and the RHCP. I cracked! I bought the CD, just so that I could hear them. If the vinyl had been out at the same time, I wouldnt have the stinkin CD. I am constantly abstaining from listening to it though, because I know I'll appreciate the music much more with this LP set.

 

I generally don't have a problem with music "piracy," but here we've got our forum host working on a project that is trying to do the right thing and present an album in the best possible sound quality on what is arguably (still) the best possible format, and people are making statements such as "a lot of the music I listen to isn't available on LP and if it is, it costs a lot more than the CD and doesn't sound any different." I'm pretty sure that Steve's vinyl of Stadium Arcadium will sound different, in a good way, than the CD. That anyone would discuss trading needledrops of this blows my mind. As I stated above, anyone who is serious enough about music to have discovered this forum could easily find $300 in their music budget to buy a ProJect or some other entry level turntable and this album on vinyl.

 

If the past several CDs from Band X have been terribly compressed, it's probably safe to assume that their new one will be, too. Before Stadium Arcadium came out, there were discussions on this board about how bad the CD was likely to sound, given the Chilis' recent digital track record. Again, 50% of this forum is devoted to complaining about how bad modern CDs sound. But at the same time, people cling to some bizarre, quasi-religious belief that major labels are somehow going to spontaneously return to Target-era CD mastering practices. Or if all 7,000 of us sign an online petition, they'll change their ways. Not. Going. To. Happen. As the interview with Rick Rubin linked to above discusses, the major labels want CDs to sound "good" in a boombox/car stereo environment, and they're gonna keep on keepin' on with what they're doing.

I'll buy the CD for the convenience and, if I'm a big enough fan of the artist in question, track down the vinyl when and if it comes out.

 

I appreciate your suggestion, John, but as I mentioned before I am not planning to buy a turntable at the moment. BTW, the turntable you mention is more in the US$ 440.00 range here in Spain. And someone thinking about purchasing it should also consider they will need a phono preamp (if they own one of those new amps that do not include them). Sounds as too much money to spend even for a 100 vinyl collection as I still own.

BTW, my mention of possible needle drops appearing on the Internet was not in justification of file sharing, it was a logical deduction of how the world functions nowadays when a certain product is not available to people in their accessible medium.

I believe that Warner should not let the opportunity go by without putting out a HiRez (remastered) version of this album using Steve's mastering. To release solely a new CD would sound like them accepting that their first CD issue is a mess (even if it truly is). It would make more sense to do a 'remastered' CD+DVD combo as has been done with Donald Fagen and Neil Young's music. This would tap into the full market. After all, albeit its underground popularity vinyl is still a niche market, as is HiRez. Different strokes for different folks.

 

I agree that it would make sense for Warners to issue an SACD or DVD-A of Steve's mastering.

 

Unfortunately I agree. But if they "keep on keepin' on with what they're doing" they won't be doing it much longer...

I'll be buying the vinyl, BTW.

 

Isnt it just *****ty that music caters to the lowest form of audio playback (boomboxes, cars, etc), ruining it for the people that care? I mean, isnt that a little backwards? Why should it sound good on a 50 dollar boombox? The difference is marginal compared to the difference you experience on good systems between a lousy, and a great recording.

Theres a reason vinyl still exists, its our way of returning the favor to the industry that turned its backs on us. You just know it HAS to stick in their craw that vinyl is even still around, much less an accepted, and preferred format among many audiophiles. I have tried and tried to give CDs a chance, but the Stadium Arcadium CD will probably be the last I buy.

I think I've heard of more people buying their first TT's for this album than any ever. The high profile, hit albums are the ones that CAN make a difference. These are the ones that show the digital generation what vinyl is capable of. If you start to see more and more of these released on well-mastered vinyl, it will continue to grow at an even faster pace. No pressure Steve

 

Perhaps as musicians' hearing deteriorates the start to prefer compressed sounds because then they can still hear all the little details?

 

In the case of the RHCP, I dont know what to think is the cause of all the compression. You have John Frusciante who is an analog believer, and one of the reasons Stadium Arcadium was recorded on analog tape to be released on vinyl. And Flea listens to a lot of old music, jazz and classical....hardly any pounding rock music. Maybe the rest of the band has gotten their way with the CDs? They are a tight group though, so I cant see how their opinions could differ so much. I think the band is aware of the compression for sure, but they probably arent the ones behind it.

 

Well, in my case, it's completely true. Barbarian Wrath, Willowtip, Century Media, etc. don't typically print vinyl versions of their albums. If they do, the sound difference is minimal at best, and the vinyl sometimes sounds worse than the CD.

I just don't listen to a lot of major label stuff outside of jazz, classic rock, and a few random bands here or there, so it wouldn't make a lot economic sense for me to save up tons of money for a good turntable and the LPs I would want when I'm satisfied with having the best easily available CD version of an album.

I mean, when I have a lot of disposable income, and I've upgraded my CD/amp/headphone setup appropriately, I'll probably go out and buy a nice turntable so I can get the best versions of some of the albums I own.

 

Generally it isn't but when the waveform looks like that, which sadly it does for most new releases, you can pretty much see what you're getting. all transients have been clipped and all dynamics squashed. end result: headache 3 songs in.

"That's not a waveform... it's a box"

Mike

 

Sorry I slipped up when I wrote "RIAA compression", I meant equalisation.

But I was wondering if an intermediate tape was made or if the RIAA and any other EQ is applied to that tape? Or are the actually "unmastered" tapes played back and RIAA and all the EQ applied in real time as the lathe is working?

That is what I'm still confused about, which is probably related to not understanding exactly how vinyl mastering is done.

I'm not so sure, a lot of non-audio qualty RHCP fans feel that the Warner Bros. Greatest Hits compilation sounds wrong. The version of Higher Ground on that CD sounds nothing like the original version on the album, and fans are aware of this and confused why it was changed (hyper-compressed) so much.

Sadly I agree with you, I am waiting on a band to decide to set a new trend by having their albums mastered so they sound good. Stadium Arcadium on vinyl is that start of that for RHCP, there is still a long way to go...

The last few RHCP LPs have sounded attrocious, cut from digital masters that are as compressed as the CDs.

Excellent, this answers my question. So any EQ being applied is happening in real time as the lathe is working?

I think this is likely to happen as well, I am not promoting copyright infringment, but the fact is there are many RHCP fans who are starting to realise that they are being ripped off when they buy the CD version due to these qualtiy issues. Yes I understand there are millions of RHCP CD buyers who do not care, but there are others that are at least becoming aware of these issues because of the impeding vinyl release.

Warner have effectively made it easier to show how bad the CDs are, and I thank them very much for it.

As far as I know there was never an unmastered bootleg version released in WAV or a lossless compressed format. It leaked from Warner Bros. as MP3 files burnt to a CD, however even though it is lossy compressed it still sounds better than the CD version!

Done, and done.

But for some people that is not an option, so I am not surprised they will be seeking out needle drops of the LP version. I've put up with bad RHCP CD mastering for 7+ years, so I can't blame them.

The only exception I make is RHCP. I know that the CDs are going to sound like varying degrees of terrible, but I have loved the band's music for 15+ years, so it is hard to stop myself from buying it.

I listen to hardly any recent music partly because of bad mastering. I'm sure I'd listen to more if I didn't feel like I was being ripped off whenever I bought a new CD.

I agree, they could add some extra tracks perhaps to appeal to people who already have the CD but don't know anything about mastering.

I've very glad that S.A. is on vinyl, but it is sad that a lot of the bonus tracks on the singles will miss out on proper mastering. Some of them are great songs, but sound terrible.

Well listen to a heap of badly mastered rock CDs, Renegades by Rage Against the Machine, De Loused at the Commatorium by The Mars Volta, and Californication by RHCP. They were all Rubin productions mastered by Vlado Meller. He loves to smash the music, that is his mastering style that people pay big bucks for.

I am not saying the band doesn't have some of the responsiblity, I'm just saying there are varying degrees of bad mastering, but Vlado Meller sees it has his personal duty to squeeze an extra 1 dB out of everything.

 

Being Warner that would be DVD-Audio.

 

Yes......thank you....the next person that asks for an SACD of this title gets a special pie in the ear from me.......it.....will.....not....happen!

 

I'd really like this on SACD!