RCA-Victor LIVING STEREO LP thoughts. And: Just What is "Miracle Surface 317X "???

Nobody wants that sound anymore? Well, I do! I'd just have to buy all your pressings, I guess..

 

And recorded in March 1954 in "experimental" stereo, with two mikes. Incredible.

I think more highly of the Classic reissues than does Steve, however. While it's true that in many cases they lack something of the "magic" of the originals, they are also superior in other respects: better low end, more extended highs, more detail, quieter surfaces (no contest there). Actually, I'm just awestruck that--profits aside--a company had such love for these records as to reissue them as beautifully and with such respect for the originals as they have.

I do own many more of the Classics than I do the originals; among the latter, the following are a disappointment and at some remove from the originals. They were all very populat titles, and I suspect overuse or poor handling resulting in deterioration of the masters. Too bad, because they're among the greatest of all the Living Stereos:

Berlioz: Symphonie Fantastique (Munch '54 version)
Moussorgsky: Pictures at an Exhibition (Reiner)
Rimsky-Korsakov: Scheherezade (Reiner)
Music For Bang, Baa-room, and Harp (Dick Schory)

Then, some of the titles that come off particularly well in their Classic reissues:

Saint-Saens: Piano Concerto No. 2 (Rubinstein/Wallenstein)
Gershwin: Concerto in F; I Got Rhythm Variations; Cuban Overture (Wild/Fiedler)
Strauss: Burlesque; Rachmaninoff: Piano Concerto No. 3 (Janis/Reiner)
Blues in Orbit (Duke Ellington [Columbia])
Debussy: Iberia, et al. (Reiner)
Strauss: Ein Heldenleben (Reiner)
Prokofiev: Cinderella Suites (Ringold)
Borodin: Symphony No. 2; Rimsky-Korsakov: Capriccio Español (Martinon)
Tchaikovsky: Capriccio Italien; Rimsky-Korsakov: Capriccio Español (Kondrashin)
Rosza: Violin Concerto, et al. (Heifetz/Hendl)

That's all for now!

MK

 

Some of the Classics just don't possess as much of that breath of life character that I love to hear so much of.

 

Classic Records' RCA LP reissues.

OUCH!

The first one I heard was "Witches Brew" and it was so bright and etched sounding that I literally thought our system was malfunctioning.

Bernie is known for being an aggressive cutter. He cuts bright, it's his trademark, he is famous for that. But Fritz Reiner is not Van Halen. You take a rather cold conductor (Reiner) and put him together with a cold sounding unmixed three channel master tape in the hands of a mastering engineer known for bright sounding records and you have a recipe for disaster!

This is just my opinion of course.

 

I recently found a all around near mint copy of Chet Atkin's Workshop Living Stereo LP at a used book store for $5.

It's not a "shaded dog" label, but the sound is incredible to these ears.

 

"Shaded dog" to me means that it was an RCA Red Seal classical recording. I just prefer to say it was in the LiViNg StErEo era, so it encompasses all of the RCA popular series recordings (LSP series) as well as the other special series like Belafonte at Carnegie Hall and the LSO ("original soundtrack" or "original cast" ??) series. I tend to buy a lot of RCAs from that era (LSP series) since there are quite a few artists I like.

I like the sound of a lot of Mancini's earliest LPs, like Mr Lucky Goes Latin and More Music from Peter Gunn, and a percussion-fest like the Shorty Rogers Afro-Cuban Influence LP I finally located a few months back.

One thing I noticed: I bought both Dance Mania CDs (Tito Puente) on the RCA Tropical Series CDs back around the early 1990s. A few years later, someone at BMG threw together a "Best of Dance Mania" CD that included tracks from both CDs, along with alternate takes. The sound on the "Best Of" is very dry, clean, and too forward (bright). I don't yet have the LPs to compare, but I'm betting that "Best Of" was pulled from what Steve is calling a "work part". These were also from the LiViNg StErEo era.

 

Totally agree. Bernie can cut so aggressively that perfect Jazz can sound like he's cutting too loud, and you get that "Spitzen" sound on dynamic passages. I guess he's trying to cheat as much dynamic slam as he can? AG says it best. Pile on too much in circumstance, and the whole record sounds terrible.

 

Those LSP and LSO records in that era have the "black dog" labels.

 

Don't forget Mancini's Pink Panther(even though it's Dynagroove), Hatari, Breakfast At Tiffani's, and Combo.

In my opinion, RCA LSPs also have the magic of LSCs but they are often overlooked, which is fine with me because I get to find them easy and cheap. I've been collecting LSPs for years and is close to having all LSP(about 80%).

 

Steve,

What setting, tweaking or equipment choice can cause a record sound too bright and too thin? I know, whatever BG uses. But how the heck does he achieve that?

If I get a hold of a three-track original tape meant to be a "work-part", and the original release (the record) sounds so spectacular, I would just make a transfer in the same way as the original cut. Why ruin a good thing?

 

Steve,

Sorry for being ambiguous. I think I misunderstood the term "work-part". Is it a "part" that needs "work"? I just edited my last post to make it clearer.

My question is what does BG use to achieve his patent bright and thin sound? Do the original tapes sound that way? Or is it BG's tweaking (or lack of it)?

 

Steve,

Are the mixed master tapes still available? I don't understand the logic in bypassing them.

It's kind of strange that sometimes Classic and BG seem wanting to duplicate everything in the original release from using a mono cutting head for mono records down to putting the original catalog numbers on the covers. But they choose to bypass the mixed master that was used to create the magic in the groove. Could it be that anybody can duplicate the original with the mixed master in hand, but only BG can make it "better than the original"?

 

Just like most people likes MFSLs over originals.

 

I thought Stan Ricker was the master "tweaker"?

 

Anybody know where I can find a copy of the Living Stereo Bible?

 

You may be able to contact Jonathan Valin through The Absolute Sound, which he writes for. I don't know if The RCA Bible is still in print. It would be nice to get a copy.

 

WD-40!

Evan

 

SCORE!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=306&item=4022361651&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVWcore!

TP sells this Lp for $100.00. Now if I trust that guy's word about the condition its in...

 

I'm nowhere near that close, but my Mancini collection (at least the RCA portion) is close to complete, including some of the ghastly dynaflex discs. There are too many for me to collect the entire LSP line, but I tend to cherry pick the artists I like. The most difficult is Shorty Rogers' LPs. Those I do find (even in mono) are very expensive. Some dealers here, too, treat LSPs about the same as LSCs, price-wise. Especially if it's Esquivel. (Although with the lounge fad mostly over with, and CDs being available of all of his albums, the demand has dropped off and prices have settled back to normal.)

I am still trying to get all stereo copies of the entire "Our Man In..." series. Which reminds me, Mancini's Our Man In Hollywood is one of his best sounding IMHO.