Needledrop Clips - Madonna Singles - Opinions Wanted

Just a quick bump before I reveal all. I'd like some more comments, if possible.

 

I guess it's time.

The only thing I changed is the integrated amp/preamp. I simply hooked the table into the Phono stage, and recorded to my computer via the Tape Out jacks.

Clip #1
Crown IC-150 Preamp
This was in my basement, and was given to me a few years ago. I never really used it, but wanted to give it a shot. One channel is lower than the other, and has a habit of picking up the local Spanish AM station. There's more background noise in general.

Clip #2
JVC RX-222 Integrated Amp
After comparing everything, this one makes sense. It's a late 80s model amp, and while it wasn't bottom of the line, it's still very much a consumer item. It makes sense that things sound slightly less ballsy.

Clip #3
Fisher KX-100 Integrated Tube Amp
This was the shocker for me. This is the amp I've used for the last two years, and have been using it for all my needledrops. I'm using Electro Harmonix 12AX7's in the phono stage. Maybe it's time for a change? Then again, maybe that's just the way the phono stage sounds.

My next step is to record CDs using the Aux inputs and see if there's a difference.

 

Wow. I can't believe they all sounded so different. I thought for sure clip 2 was a different cart!

That was great. I really enjoyed that!

I still say blind testing is the only way to go.

 

I Keith,

You mean people have been making negative comments about her music on one of your threads? I don't get why people who don't like her bother to read threads about her music. Well, no worries! I like Madonna's music.

Anyway, Here are my picks:

Like A Virgin:#1 moved me the most. It was a tossup between #1 and #3, but the sonics had the edge on #1. That kick bass should be loud and hard! That's the way it was mixed to sound, and i've heard this song in many ways on all the formats.

#2 was lackluster.n:


Live To Tell: #1, hands down! It was the fullest and most detailed, and had the best channel separation. It was in-your-face, but that's how the song impacts you. I concentrated on that hi-hit in the left channel too. It was crisp and clear.

#2 was very...uh..how do you put it...distant.n:


Vogue:One more time, #1 wins! It made me feel the most like I was being engulfed in the sound. It was lighter on the bass than the second one, but #1 had it!

#3 was in another club somewhere. It was unexciting, to say the least.n:

 

That's the problem I had with the clips I didn't like, they were too laid back and relaxed, not what you want for this music at all.

I accepted a bit more compressed sound for sheer power. I assume the 45s were used in all cases. Even the ones you guys say sound more natural to you don't sound right to me. Again, my criteria wasn't about any audiophile attributes, just what sounded best to my ears.

 

I didn't listen to the last tune but I certainly agree 1 was the overall winner. 3 was the worst. 2 was too middle aged sounding, you know, soft and unhip.

 

I don't agree that #1 is the winner. To my ears it sounds by far the worst for the reasons I posted earlier. 2 and 3 are close but if I had to pick one, it'd be 2. I don't find it laid back at all. If anything there's a sense of space with it that's just not there with 1, partially because of the hihat clipping (although the hihat in the intro sounds gated and synthetic anyway.

Here try this for comparison's sake: http://download.yousendit.com/01B055DE2E2BFFBD

 

Nope! Only "Vogue" was from a 7" single. "Live to Tell" was from the 45 RPM 12" single and "Like a Virgin" was from the Canadian-pressed LP that was cut at Masterdisk by Bob Ludwig.

 

This is where the thread goes to the Hardware forum.

Should I be looking into another Phono stage? Should I roll some tubes? Should I have the Crown preamp fixed up and find a power amp? Ditch all of them and get something else?

I might post clips of some rock and roll and see what they sound like.

 

I found plenty of "air" on the 1st clips. That Crown pre-amp is really good!

 

The Crown does not have a great reputation. Go figure.

 

To be honest, I thought the Crown made the music sound small, constricted and completely unnatural. I'd ditch it for sure.

 

I'm doing some rock music right now, and I'll make the same comparisons again.

 

Ok, some non-Madonna clips. I mixed them up this time. The Fisher is not present, so one is the Crown and one is the JVC.

Nick Lowe - "Cruel to Be Kind" (from Labour of Lust WLP)
Clip A
Clip B

Heart - "Magic Man" (from Dreamboat Annie Starline LP/RCA Record Club)
Clip A
Clip B

 

The Lowe clips are close because the recording seems grainier than I remember it but the first one seems to have a slight bit better definition around the guitar strums and cymbals.

For the Heart, the second clip sounds better to me. It's similar to the first Lowe clip in that I hear more realistic space around the sounds. Take the chime-like sounds at the very end, one the second clip they seem distinct and clear. On the first one, they come across as somewhat of a blurry high-pitched sound.

These things are always tricky but I'd say Clip A Lowe and Clip B Heart are the winners this time.

 

Jamie, you're up next.

 

The first Nick Lowe clip is better. The second is a bit closed in. The top end seems to be somewhat muted.

The second Heart Clip is better. The first one sounds muffled. You can hear it on the top end of the snare drum. That song needs all the openess it can get.

 

Alright!

 

The first Lowe clip and the second Heart clip is the Crown.

 

Steve, we're good.

 

Hmm, the Crown IC-150 came out in 1970. I'm curious, does anyone know the specs? What's the input resistance for the phono stage? etc, etc.

 

Interesting. I thought the Crown sounded terrible for the Madonna songs yet it sounds better on these ones. Go figure!

 

Nick Lowe: The second sample sound fuller, but that record has lots of siblence.

Heart: The second clip had more depth and life. The first one was plain dull and lifeless.

 

I'm far from being expert at this, but I'm not really hearing sibilance. It is a pretty bright mix, but I thought that the spitting "esss" in certain words was sibilance. I'm not really hearing that. What am I missing?

 

I don't really hear sibilance. It's more of a graininess or distortion on the highs, like the transients of the guitar strums. The details seem blurred and the definition of the individual sounds gets lost.