Maybe vinyl isn't for me

My experience has been like yours. Bought my vinyl rig at a local dealer and had him set it up. Plug n play all the way. When I get my next cart I may try to learn how to install it myself

 

You didn't even give it a fair chance, frankly. Try replacing your digital front end with Zune and see how happy you are with that!

 

One less person raiding the bins, frankly. Need to steer more people away like this. Good work everyone!

 

That is fine if you are happy with "pretty good." and are worried about "real world prices." I totally get the issues we all face with budgets and basic practicality. But if we take price out of the equation and consider the persuit of sound that rises above "pretty good" then one needs highend vinyl playback IMO. For example, I have the entire Fantasy top 100 LPs from APO. How do you think they stack up on my Forsell/Koetsu rosewood signature/ARC SP 10 against the commercially available counterparts on digital?

 

For me it comes down to time, money, and benefit. It sounds like I need to spend several thousand dollars and a massive amount of time (in perpetuity) so I can hear vinyl playback that betters my digital playback. That just doesn't make sense to me at this point in my life (28).

I admit it. I fully expected to buy a cheap setup and hear sound that was worse overall, but better in some areas. All I hear is crap. Real crap. This is surely because of my refusal to commit the requisite time and money, but... well... see above....

How about this? Which path requires the absolute lowest commitment of time and money to hear SOMETHING good coming off of vinyl and out through a pair of Maggies? I'm in trial mode here. I'm not trying to jump headlong in. I'm trying to figure out if vinyl is for me and I won't spend multiple thousands and huge amounts of time just to find out.

Edit: The fact that I need to add an entire component (preamp) to the signal chain in order to use a turntable really rubs me the wrong way too. As I said in the original post, vinyl is actually degrading my digital sound in that way.

 

That's fine if you have the budget to afford a reference turntable, but irrelevant for even the vast majority of audiophiles, who have to take cost, both of the hardware and the media, into account.

 

LOL!

 

Probably a new ProJect Debut or better, Rega P1 or P2 or Music Hall, with $100 cart, Grado, Ortofon, or Sumiko or Audio Technica. Plus a budget phono pre amp, maybe $200 retail. So figure $600 to $800 retail, less if you can find a really good deal or risk trying something used.

 

I can't take too much credit. I started a thread here over a year ago asking for opinions on vintage Duals vs. entry level Regas and Pro-Jects, since I was inclined to go the latter route, but realized that vintage might be better bang for my buck. People soon steered me towards Thorens instead, for which I am grateful. The AT440MLa was another forum recommendation that worked out for me. The Kenwood was more of a lark--I saw a thread on my particular model, fell in love with the idea and looks of it, and in short order was able to get a good condition one from a local seller.

Putting these components together (along with a variety of speakers in need of refoam that I've purchased since then) and working on optimizing them has been a journey, to say the least, with some frustrations but even more feelings of satisfaction and enjoyment. I'm so glad I didn't go the entry-level Rega, Pro-Ject or Music Hall route. I sometimes wonder what would have happened if I'd gotten a Technics 1200 or somesuch, but I'm in love my Thorens, so it's rather a moot question.

That's not to say that there aren't things I'd like to try out (tubes, RCM, dedicated phono section, improved amplification and speakers, for example), but I'm very happy with what I have now. It suits my present circumstances, and to be honest, I could be content with this system forever. It's merely the knowledge that possible upgrades exist that makes me consider them, not any major dissatisfaction with my current set up.)

 

I was responding to the claim that one needs $1000 to $1500 for decent vinyl playback.

 

I agree with those that are saying you need to go with something more than a P1 and a $150 cartridge hooked up to a receiver to really hear what analog is capable of. In a sense, vinyl is a challenging pursuit for at least two reasons - you need to spend some time and you need to spend some money. Both are necessary, especially if you want to track down the best pressings - those that blow away the best CD for those titles that you really care about - and then play them back all cleaned up on a really nice table and phono stage. Figure a minimum of $2K for a few records and the analog rig, twice that is much better, and twice that is better still. Just depends on how far down the path you want to go. I wouldn't want to be without vinyl personally, but then I've been collecting records for many years. Also, Maggies are great reviewing speakers, but not the most forgiving for bad recordings or bad gear.

 

Nothing is for everybody so if vinyl isn't for you, it isn't for you.

 

I don't, normally, beyond a dry brush before I spin each side. I'm fairly careful about the quality of records I buy (I mostly buy used) so that helps. My AT440MLa often dredges up dust that the dry brush misses, so I realize that there's room for improvement there. One step at a time.

 

Sometimes, time and patience pay off, too.

 

HAHA! Love that one! That's right-you DEFINITELY don't want to get into vinyl...and if you go to my local Goodwill-I strongly suggest you focus on the CD's...Vinyl stinks!

 

It is worth the effort to really clean your records, even if it is by hand. If your stylus is collecting dust (probably is dirt, actually) you need to wash your records. Vacuum cleaners are expensive, but you can get your records almost as clean by hand washing, which is inexpensive and is worth the effort. A clean record has a clearer sound and does not soil and wear your stylus. Lots of threads here on DIY record washing methods. Try a simple method on a few records, put them in fresh sleeves after cleaning.

 

Like I said, you don't have to spend thousands of dollars. That idea came from someone who has that kind of money. The majority of us don't. But, it just sounds to me like you just aren't ready or very interested to getting into vinyl at all. If and when you start hurtin' for the music you can't find on CD, you'll reconsider it.

This says it all. Why did you waste your time and ours?

Forget it! You don't want to get into vinyl. And, you won't until you desire music that can't be found any other way.

You are stuck on that suggestion of having to spend tens of thousands of dollars. You don't. Remember, when you read comments and advice, you always have to consider the source. Yes, Tonepub gives excellent advice all can benefit from, but he is speaking from a different plane. He recognizes budget sound, but I think that's not where his head usually is.

You should visit some highj-end shops that deal in vinyl, or check out some friends' set-ups.

 

Just keep in mind that no matter how clean a record looks when you buy it there can be all kinds of dirt deep in the grooves that will prematurely where out your cartridge and degrade the sound a bit.

You are right though, if you can't lay down the big bucks all at once it is a one step at a time process.

 

Dude, go to a dealer and have a demo on some top-flight gear. Stop wasting your own and everyone else's time with this.

Also, at 28, your ears are shot from CD. Forget it.

 

Umm... Maggies are anything *but* neutral. The fact is that some Maggies have a big fat hump right in the 100hz band. And I've heard more than my fair share of cheap vinyl rigs that do the same. 1+1 = disaster in this case.

Forget this guy... he keeps poking around, refuses to take advice, now just talks about all the crap he hears with his crap vinyl rig. Plus, he's so young he doesn't even know what to listen for. Waste of time.

 

Frankly, you listen for the same thing on vinyl as you do on CD. You don't listen to a format, you listen for quality.

Yeah, ggking7 is too young to have lived in the era of vinyl. Unless his taste in music expand greatly, he may never need to hear music that will never make it to the digital realm.

 

You know my tastes are broad enough to not limit myself to CDs and a huge majority of the recordings in my primary genres aren't on CD.

 

The first Recommended Components issue of Stereophile I read, in 1987, I think, said outright at the top of the "Turntables" section something to the effect of "any audiophile worth his salt will have a turntable." If anyone has one of those old issues, I would really appreciate hearing the actual language. It was so condescending, it put me off records, and eventually Stereophile, for another twelve years.

 

There's nothing saying you can't get a turntable later. Just do what you need now to make your new speakers sound their best with your existing digital music system.

To be honest, when you were ranting the other day about "needing" to listen to records or you were going to explode, or die, or whatever, I thought your records were all you had, softwarewise. You have, in your own words, an "awesome" digital listening system. Enjoy it!

I think I might get one of those DACs like yours.

 

I'm gathering from all of your posts that your goal turns out to be better sound, and not an exploration of the vinyl format?

For achieving better sound, I'd agree that investing in a vinyl rig doesn't sound like your next good move with your budget and desire for immediate results.

I think the choice to get those Outlaw monos (I've owned Outlaw in the past) will bring about great improvement over the underpowered NAD you initially paired with those Maggies. Synergy is everything - enjoy