Maybe vinyl isn't for me

I wouldn't want to buy a stack of used records that was played on one of these.

 

Yes you can get better sound.
Yes it does cost more.
Yes it is more work.
Yes it is more complicated.
Yes, vinyl may not be for you.

 

I had to spend a good $2000 on up before I was really satisfied with my analog ring. However even my first stab at it - a Rega P2 with an Ortofon 2M Red and tube preamp was a step up from my digital rig.

I've pretty much given up on digital except for background / second system listening. I'll throw more money into my turntable before I do anything else.

 

So what does one do when they want to listen to a title that is simply destroyed by the mastering on any commercially released digital form?

 

If you say that $1000-1500 is to much for you then yes good sounding vinyl is out of reach.

I've gone through most of the thread and don't really think anyone has mentioned anything about record cleaning machines which is also something that is required to enjoy vinyl. I did see an odd comment referring to cleaning your vinyl but never went deeper then that.

 

Probably true but probably not all that often on Maggies or something comparable and not compared to real highend digital.

 

i'm sure that i read that too, seems that 'we'(you too) was in the same thread.

cheers!

 

They way I see it is if you are serious about entering the vinyl arena you need to budget $2K to really get started.

Turntable $600
Cartridge $300
Phono Stage $500
RCM $400 - $600

To experience the benefit of vinyl it will cost more than even a budget entry CD player. Contrary to what other believe the most important part is the RCM. If you grew up on digital, you will not be happy listening to surface noise. There are other ways of cleaning LP but you will quickly grow frustrated. I bought my first RCM long before I became an audiophile, I spent as much for it as my TT at the time.

 

I don't think the situation is all that bad, though I suppose it depends on the sort of music you enjoy. And, on the flip side of the equation, (at least my perception of things) it isn't like it was 20 years ago with people virtually giving away clean or mint lps anymore.

 

It is kind of hard to place a monetary figure on just how much to spend, as one can find discounts, deals, and used gear all over the place. All one needs to do is look around. When buying audio, it's best to plan. I plan and investigate before I buy anything. You can't just jump into buying vinyl gear like you can with CD.

There are those who may not be as interested in vinyl like me, or anyone else here, and certainly money's tight these days, but I still try to steer newbies clear of those cheap turntables. But, even that doesn't help when you have a few guy on this forum who will tell someone that their $150 turntable sounds "good enough".

 

I guess it's all relative. My $200 Thorens and (when I bought it) $100 AT440MLa running through the phono section of my $90 KR-7600 sounds great to me. Total investment: just south of $400. And I don't even have an RCM.

 

it is only as bad as the number of titles any given person has to live with with awful mastering and the significance of those titles to that listener. If we are talking about a couple titles then it aint a biggy but for audiophiles with diverse tastes and a desire to go deep into various catalogs it will end up being a pretty substantial problem. I am sure this is why it is often said that if one is serious about the music then one needs qaulity vinyl playback as an option. I think this is where we get misunderstandings. it isn't a matter of seriousness. One can be very serious and have a very narrow taste in music. this does not make one a "lesser" audiophile. It really is a matter of figuring out where one is at, where one wants to go and how to get there. If one wants top quality sound and is interested in a wide variety of titles then one will ultimately need high quality vinyl playback. Of course this can also be cost prohibitive. That makes the choice of paths a lot more complicated. It doesn't diminish one's audiophile status.

 

How one spends money at each price point is critical. also expectations need to be realistic and one needs to always rememeber the factor of mastering. Clearly you put some thought into buying at a price point and was payed off for doing so. that allows you to enjoy better mastered LPs for less money. IOW you win.

 

Me too, but in the end, people are going to do what they are going to do, witness what ggking did, despite warnings from a majority on this forum.

Last year, one of the trainers from my gym mentioned that she was into lps; was starting to spin her parents old Beatles lps and now looking to build her own collection. She couldn't believe that I actually was selling more lps than I was buying; aren't they all destined to become rare collectibles? No, I told her. Some lps are collectible, others are valuable only if you actually play them. Well, she said, I am building a collection of classic rock and indie lps. So I ask, what table are you using? None so far, but I plan to get one real soon. I tell her, there is a cost of entry into vinyl, if she wants advice, just ask but whatever else she does DON'T BUY ONE OF THOSE CHEAP CROSLEYS OR IONS.

Fast forward a couple of months. I ask, so did you buy a turntable? Yes, she sheepishly replied. I bought a Crosley.

 

A Thorens is a far cry from the Technics the OP picked up.

 

Your expectations are probably not as high as the original poster either. Everyone is looking for different things in audio, glad to hear you are enjoying what you have.

Only thing that puzzles me is how do you clean your records? If you don't how is it possible to get good sound from them? Even brand new vinyl needs to be cleaned to get the residue off them before they are played.

 

As I mentioned elsewhere, I managed to hear a wonderful sound out of a system using a stock version of the old AR xa turntable, something I never managed to do with the five AR xa's I've owned. Obviously there is some skill in getting less expensive audio gear, particularly turntables, to sing. I'm lucky enough now to be using a serious, vintage bit of kit and can clearly hear what's good in my good LPs. Unfortunately, I can also hear what's bad with my bad LPs.

Upshot is that skill and luck factor into the LP game. ggking7 should check out the turntables at some high-end audio boutique in order to hear what's possible with records and record players. When everything is working, LP playback sings in a way that digital usually doesn't. But it really doesn't come cheap and it really doesn't come easy.

 

I am strictly unlimited and fully equipped.

 

I consider myself an audiophile with pretty diverse taste who likes to go deep into the jazz side of things. After years of messing around with vinyl, I basically shifted my focus to acquiring titles on digital (and upgrading my digital rig) 3 years ago and haven't looked back, though I haven't completely given up on records.

Some digital remastering is really bad, but most is OK, at least outside of the rock/pop world. With jazz in particular, with the exception of some of the RVGs, most jazz on cd sounds pretty good to my ears, better than most of the lp pressings out there at real world prices. I will concede that original pressings of old jazz sounds better, but I cannot afford to buy thousands, or even hundreds of those.

As pertains pop and rock, I will concede that a lot of recent remasters suck, but older cd reissues usually sound decent and are abundant and as cheap as, if not cheaper than lps these days. I will concede though, that, I tend not to be too critical of mediocre sounding rock or pop recordings on cd or lp. I don't think a lot of these were all that well recorded to begin with and for that reason I tend to listen to rock and pop records in non critical settings, like car, computer or portable.

 

Really? You're going to let this experience with a cheap, crappy, apparently broken turntable end your interest in vinyl? C'est la vie!

 

Personally, I think GG's impatience with "wanting it all, right now" (sounds like something off the cover of Cosmo, doesn't it?), and w/o being willing to spend what it takes to get even an entry level vinyl front end did him a disservice. GG received a lot of good advice about what to do and how to proceed, but against the advice of almost everyone here, he rushed in and bought a crap (and bent) TT and a cheap cart, has a unsatisfactory experience, and them proclaims, "I'm off vinyl"...and likely will come to the conclusion that vinyl cannot provide as compelling and musically and emotionally engaging experience as Redbook CD.

That's so sad, because those of us that have been patient and taken the time to research what type of table to get, audition various flavors of carts, and experimenting with the phono stage that meets their needs have such a different experience every day.

Now he's not happy with the NAD (even though it's not been run-in yet at all), wants to upgrade the speakers immediately, and is getting ready to get a set of Outlaw monoblocks.

Sorry, GG, but to be honest, and I don't mean this in any way but what I see as an outsider looking in, but you come across to me as frantic in your search for something...

You've received some advice here to slow down, reflect, and think...my recommendation is that you listen to it...

 

The Warmth Of Old Vinyl

Ahhh Yes! More vinyl for us—Smithers, place another LP on the fire, would you?

 

This is the type of thrill of record collecting that I love.

Was listening to Shelly Manne's 2,3,4 on lp last night and it sounded like Coleman Hawkins and Shelly Manne were in the room. Put the mp3 that I bought of it on Amazon on in the car and it sounds like a squashed mess.

 

Nuff-said about the need for a turntable!