Indian instruments - Love You To

Why not just bounce down to two tracks? I don't necessarily disagree with you, the whole thing just doesn't add up.

 

The reason that I think they bounced down to one track is that the vocals and the tambourine were done after the bounce and Lewisohn says they didn't use one of the tracks. So the original Take 6 being on 1 track, the vocals being on another, and the tambourine being on the last track would take up the three used tracks.

 

They doubled up on tracks in plenty of instances because they had so few tracks to spare. I think it's unlikely they would have put a tambourine on a track by itself, it seems a waste, especially in light of the economy they usually employed (cf backing vocals and tambourine on the same track on "Rain" and backing vocals and bass on the same track of "Paperback Writer")

Jason

 

What is the instrument that comes in on the chorus, when the chord changes? It's under "I'll make love to..." and "Make Love Singing..." etc.

 

I didn't mean to imply that the tambourine is on the track by itself. The electric fuzz guitar is on there as well. I also hear the acoustic guitar, but other forum members hear that on the same track as the vocals. Either way it makes sense.

 

That's exactly it!!! Because of the limitations of 4-track recording, Martin often bounced everything down to 1-track....allowing that precious extra track for further overdubs. There is also mention of "editing" to the final take 7, again no quite sure what was done in the phase...adding ADT??Isn't it possible that the last overdub was the tamboura, as mentioned by Marky...and not a tambourine, which was recorded back on take 3? It's entirely plausible that one of the engineers wrote "tamb" on the session sheets and Lewisohn assumed it meant tambourine. The acoustic guitar definitely is altered in some way....be it fed through a leslie speaker, tuned down a step or quite possibly, as mentioned by Jason, it's a semi-acoustic guitar played without amplification. Ron

 

Ok gotcha.

 

Ron, it's not possible that the tamboura was overdubbed last, because it is in the same stereo imaging spot as the sitar. It has to be part of the bounce down. My guess is that Lewisohn made the mistake that Marky mentions initially - that is with his first mention of tambourine. After all he talks about "additional" tambourine, right?

 

I believe that's an electric guitar, played through a volume pedal to control the fade in/fade out.

Jason

 

Thanks, Steve. I hope you didn't read any misinformation whoppers.

 

It is very easy once you've played a tamboura to pick out the sound. Dave was right about Tomorrow Never Knows. The tamboura is the first thing you hear on that song. They also used it on the last verse in "Getting Better" and in the verses of "Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds."

This is my opportunity to show what I've done with a tamboura When we're done here everybody on this forum wll be able to pick out a tamboura from a mile away.

Listen to the above mentioned Beatles tracks then listen to these 2 songs by my band where I play a pretty prominent tamboura throughout:

Friend For The Day
For anyone interested:
I wrote this song and played the tamboura, drums, sitars, and trumpets. It's an odd song for us because the drummer is playing organ and I'm not singing. If my speakers are wired right, the tamboura is more on the left side. You'll hear that same "Love You To"-type drone.

Wild Bird
For those of you interested:
This one was written by the drummer and he plays the mandolin (doubled). I'm singing most of the vocals and playing tamboura (left side on verses), bongos, tabla drum (my Bhayan drum is broken) and I arranged the string quartet (triple tracked).

Peace Love and Mahareshi Mahesh Marky OR Hope the songs guru on you
Marky

 

Except that Lewisohn says George "added another vocal" after the bounce, which seems to imply there was already a vocal before the bounce.

 

Marky, that's pretty cool. You did the link for the second song wrong, but it's fixed on my quote above.

 

Yes, I would guess that the first vocal he talks about is the "guide" vocal. It is possible that the first vocal was bounced, but it could not have been bounced with everything else onto 1 track.

 

Thanks Another Side!!! I fixed it on mine too now.


Peace Love and DOH!!
Marky

 

He doesn't say anything about additional tambourine, the only tambourine he mentions is as the overdub onto take 7. It's imaged in the same spot with the volume-pedaled fuzz guitar in the refrains, yet that instrument is supposed to have been an overdub onto take 6 not 7.

 

Which is why I think it and the acoustic guitar were bounced to a second track. Otherwise where does Paul's vocal come from? His take 7 overdub wasn't used.

 

Plus there's evidence that George manually double-tracked his vocal in at least a few places (thanks to Nick in the UK for pointing these out):

0:42 'so fast' - the word 'fast' extends longer on one of the tracks.
1:12 'a new one' - slight timing discrepancy, with one vocal entering a bit late.
1:16 'but what you've got' - the glide on 'what' is faster on one vocal track, and the 'ch' sounds are staggered.

So it looks like there must be a lead vocal recording on take 6, perhaps recorded over the guide vocal, PLUS that additional vocal Lewisohn mentions overdubbed onto take 7.

Jason

 

The reason for that discrepancy is that ADT does not merely make the second vocal trail the first like an echo. It has oscillating tendencies meaning that it is speeded up and slowed down throughout. What you mention is possible, but it makes the construction of the track much more complicated than Lewisohn mentions in his book. Plus it would involve the use of an additional track, and that would contradict Lewisohn completely.

 

Well, we agree that the tambourine was overdubbed onto Take 7. I'm just trying to place the recording of the tamboura.

What does Lewisohn say exactly about the fuzz guitar, Steve?

 

That's possible. They need to isolate the vocal to use the ADT, so they could have kept the vocal on a separate track when they bounced onto Take 7. But doesn't Lewisohn say the lead vocals were redone after the bounce?

 

He doesn't say they were redone, he says (I have the book right here in front of me, is that cheating?) "George added another vocal." After describing take 1, he says "The sitar came in at take 3 and again as an overdub onto take 6 along with a tabla, bass and fuzz guitar." For take 7 he says "George added another vocal, Ringo contributed tambourine and Paul sang high pitch harmonies..." That's it. He doesn't say anything about a tamboura at all, and what does he mean by "the sitar came in at take 3"? As part of the basic take or an overdub onto take 3? You're not the only one that's confused! Maybe he'll clear it up when his book comes out in 10 years.

 

Right, except that there is a distinct difference between the sound of something manually double-tracked and something that has ADT applied. Listen to any song pre-1966 where they manually double-tracked the vocal and then listen to the examples I cited. I'm suggesting it's the same effect. I hear ADT on the lead vocal and rhythm guitar, but it doesn't create as discrete an effect as you're saying. If it did, we would hear what sounds like two acoustic guitars and two lead vocals throughout. From what I hear on this and other songs, that's not what ADT does.

Jason

 

What he means is that the first time that George used a sitar on the song was on the third take. The quote: "and again as an overdub onto take 6 along with a tabla, bass and fuzz guitar" is confusing, but essentially he means that Take 6 consisted of those instruments plus the "guide vocal" and an acoustic guitar. Then after the bounce, George would have re-done his vocal with Paul on high pitch harmonies, and Ringo would have recorded the tambourine.

Doesn't he mention anything about more guitar or the fuzz bass?