George Martin quotes re: stereo vs. mono

I don't dislike the stereo Hard Day's Night, but I can't really say it's a lovely stereo mix. It's just the rhythm track in one channel, the vocals in center and overdubs in the other channel. All of the songs are like that. Same thing with Beatles for Sale.

That doesn't mean that they are not nice to listen to, but as far as stereo mixes go they are pretty wonky.

 

I've been doing the same thing actually! In fact I read this same quote last night. I have to say it's exactly how I view them. I enjoy the Mono mixes much, much more than the stereos... but listening to the stereos as a curiosity is enjoyable. When I want to hear Rubber Soul, Revolver, etc. and jsut enjoy... it's mono all the way.

 

Exactly. It baffles me that anyone considers these mixes some kind of "achievement" when that's basically all they could do with them to make them "stereo" - simply because that's the way they were routed to tape when recorded. And how they are somehow considered some kind of improvement over the more unified and powerful mono mixes is another mystery.

I wonder if anyone doubts that when the Beatles themselves approved the final mixes for original release that they even bothered listening to the stereos?

 

Better yet, if you're REALLY wanting to tweak things to suit your own tastes, back in the olden days they had something called an "equalizer", that enabled you to emphasize/de-emphasize the sound to your heart's content.....

 

Well, here I go replying to one of my own posts, but since I now have heard the mono box, I can weigh in on my own question. The mono box CD's sound great. I hear no lack of bass or life. I have the White Album 2009 stereo remaster and having heard both, the mono is a much more pleasant listen. I can't imagine anyone preferring the enhanced EQ of the stereo versions.

 

Sir George will be 84 years young on January 3! Through the years I think he has deliberately said certain things to protect his and the Beatles legacy. I do think he has been more forgetful in the last 20 years or so. Just too many inconsistencies, often proven wrong by the likes of Lewisohn and other scholars. Sometimes, as when I saw his lecture/multimedia show a few years back, he seemed spot-on and his charm and personality just oozed wisdom; other times he seems to have truly forgotten specific details (of course I know that no one, especially a genetleman in his 80's, can be expected to remember everything) and drops into cliche-speak.

One sad comment concerns the recent remasters. When asked why EMI used his 1987 remixes of Help and Rubber Soul he said he couldn't recall ever remixing them at all!!! Too bad that Allan Rouse and EMI never asked George what mix he preferred. If he had told them he couldn't even remember remixing these two titles, the original 1965 mixes would have been the defacto choice...no question. Ron

 

The mono remasters could have done with sounding brighter, but no doubt "audiophiles" wouldn't have approved of that despite a lot of them sounding quite muddy.

 

Sad part is, with his memory loss, he may not have been sure as to what decisions needed to be made as far as the remasters go....

Evan

 

I happen to think that, if anything, they sound just a touch too edgy -- not muddy. But regardless, understand that if they had been "brightened", it would have been at the expense of something else.

 

Exactly my view as well.

 

I remember hearing about his confusion over the 1987 remixes and his claim that he didn't remember remixing them. Perhaps he misunderstood (one hopes) the question and thought that they'd asked him if he had remixed them AGAIN.

 

I agree. It never bothered me. It seems to bother those who listen mostly on headphones.

 

There are those out there who prefer enhanced over natural in more ways than just EQ. I don't know who they are.

 

Sacrilege! They sound perfect the way they are!

 

I remember a comment from Mr. Rouse re the '87 HELP & RUBBER SOUL mixes being used on the current discs. The gist of it was (paraphrasing) George Martin was dissatisfied with the original stereo mixes for these albums back when he produced the '80's remixes, and they were basically respecting this by using them again currently on the standard issue discs.

 

Here is an except from an interview of Stan Ricker. For those that don't know, Stan was given the job of cutting the Mobile Fidelity Beatles vinyl from the original EMI master tapes. His comments seem interesting (to me) within the context of this thread.


STAN: "One of the things that interested me was that with some of the earlier Beatles' tapes the voices singing were all on one channel, and the instruments were on the other channel. And it's not what you'd truly call stereo. It was, in fact, two mono tracks which were originally designed to be combined into a mono release. But we found these things very interesting in their original form.

So a discussion grew into, "Well, how do you think we ought to release these things? Should we be true to our format and say, we're gonna release 'em exactly as the tapes are, or we're gonna release 'em exactly like the original records were?" Well, we really didn't want to release them exactly as the original records were.

One of the very interesting reasons for that, among other things, was that the MoFi cutting system was dedicated, hard wired stereo. There was no mono switch on this thing at all. I'm sure I could have easily enough rigged up some wiring to make it mono, but we thought it would be really interesting to release the records as the tapes really existed.

And we got into kind of a discussion. "Well, geez, you think we ought to call them up and ask them?" or something like this, you know. The net result was we placed a phone call to George Martin to find out, "Well, sir, do you have any preferences, or do you care?" or whatever, you know. And the tone of his answer was that he seemed to be quite much burned out on Beatles stuff and really didn't give a rat's behind what we did with it. So we elected to cut it exactly as the tape format presented itself. And then later I heard that Mr. Martin bitched vigorously about "Why the hell did you release it that way?" And I believe my answer to it was, "Well, earlier I phoned you up and asked you and you, in your words, told me you didn't give a **** what I did with the things." "So," I said, "It's a little late now to complain about it." He agreed and so, rightly, it is. That was the end of that hassle."

From
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/Magazine/rickerinterview/ricker12.htm

 

I mostly listen on headphones as well! The only slight bother is the very few really early tracks that don't have extra instruments that come onto the "vocal" side of the stereo field.

 

I don't recall any mention of the Abbey Road team using the '87 remixes out of any respect for GM. I don't remember any clear-cut answer of why the EMI suits forced Rouse & Co. to use them. I believe the giving George Martin respect angle was all speculation.

 

Thanks for the perspective in comparison to the posts here.

 

There is so much comedy in this story, it's stunning!

 

Grant, Rouse made mention of this a few times in various interviews and perhaps here on this forum too. There was a few pointed questions if Martin and other former Emi emplyees were involved in the process and he said that it was time for the "new" crop at EMI to do the work. When asked specifically why they used the 1987 remixes he said it was done out of respect for Sir George. When Martin was asked about this he said that he didn't remember remixing the two CDs in question. No idle speculation here. Enjoy wading through the old threads Ron

 

no. HELP and RS are pure mud.

i don't understand why so many here love lack of clarity.

 

the "new crop" stuff is here:
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/fe...making-of-the-beatles-remastered-catalog.html

 

I believe Ron/Brainwashed has made reference to this on several occasions. So I would consider it to be second-hand, but more solid than the average rumor/speculation. Sorry to be so late responding to your question, I have only read this now. (I have no idea if it will come to pass or not, especially since all the planets have to get into perfect alignment for Apple to approve anything Beatles-related, but I'd be interested to hear remixes if they do them.)

 

I remember now. Still, the answer sounds suspect.