Genesis - early CD versions thread (Ver. 2)

I am slow. I'll look again at mine tonight, compare to the pix, and look for differences you could ask a seller about.

Black Elk- You're satisfied with the US? I always thought of this V/C and the US as Ying and Yang: need both. I know I didn't like the Gold. Need to recheck my notes ...

 

No, not a case of being satisfied with the US, but my interest in Genesis goes downhill very quickly after A Trick Of The Tail (Seconds Out excepted). Abacab is the last of their studio albums that interests me, but that interest is spread thin. So, I've been in no hurry to hunt down a V/C. However, if I stumble across one cheap in the used bins....

Based on all my comparisons, I am under no illusions that I would prefer the V/C -- I prefer the V/Cs in ALL cases. I find that all the 'air' has been sucked out of the Atco/Atlantics.

Having said all that, I still don't know how I ended up with the two different Version 3s of this title???

 

BE: Got it. I feel that (slow) downhill slide from ATOTT too, but I still really like up through Duke. Abacab has a few good tunes on it. Things really turned for me with the s/t. Like Mama a lot, and seeing Home by the Sea live sort of redeemed the studio track for me, but after that ...

OK, from post 197, mine is the same as the 2nd one but my CD looks different.

Mine doesn't have the black ring around the edge (although you can see a ring there almost where it could go), and mine has Al to within about 3mm of the physical edge of the center hole.

Does have the 8pg booklet with lyrics with the track listing on the very last page. Maybe that indeed could be a differentiator.

 

Hi,

For first...
I would like to ask if any of the members of the forum have the following release of the album ... And Then There Were Three ... remaster version from 2007 and how it sounds?

Its worth it to buy it?

 

Secondly...

Code:

Exact Audio Copy V0.99 prebeta 5 from 4. May 2009

EAC extraction logfile from 21. May 2010, 18:30

Genesis / Abacab

Used drive  : TSSTcorpCDDVDW TS-L632N   Adapter: 0  ID: 0

Read mode               : Secure
Utilize accurate stream : Yes
Defeat audio cache      : No
Make use of C2 pointers : No

Read offset correction                      : 6
Overread into Lead-In and Lead-Out          : No
Fill up missing offset samples with silence : Yes
Delete leading and trailing silent blocks   : Yes
Null samples used in CRC calculations       : No
Used interface                              : Native Win32 interface for Win NT & 2000
Gap handling                                : Not detected, thus appended to previous track

Used output format : Internal WAV Routines
Sample format      : 44.100 Hz; 16 Bit; Stereo


TOC of the extracted CD

     Track |   Start  |  Length  | Start sector | End sector 
    ---------------------------------------------------------
        1  |  0:00.00 |  7:03.15 |         0    |    31739   
        2  |  7:03.15 |  4:40.07 |     31740    |    52746   
        3  | 11:43.22 |  6:02.55 |     52747    |    79951   
        4  | 17:46.02 |  4:34.10 |     79952    |   100511   
        5  | 22:20.12 |  7:30.63 |    100512    |   134324   
        6  | 29:51.00 |  3:24.20 |    134325    |   149644   
        7  | 33:15.20 |  4:27.15 |    149645    |   169684   
        8  | 37:42.35 |  4:58.37 |    169685    |   192071   
        9  | 42:40.72 |  4:30.00 |    192072    |   212321   


Track  1

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\01. Genesis - Abacab.wav

     Peak level 96.7 %
     Track quality 99.9 %
     Copy CRC 09B0A280
     Copy OK

Track  2

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\02. Genesis - No Reply at All.wav

     Peak level 86.8 %
     Track quality 100.0 %
     Copy CRC ECDCADBA
     Copy OK

Track  3

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\03. Genesis - Me and Sarah Jane.wav

     Peak level 84.2 %
     Track quality 99.9 %
     Copy CRC 68DC1113
     Copy OK

Track  4

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\04. Genesis - Keep It Dark.wav

     Peak level 83.7 %
     Track quality 100.0 %
     Copy CRC 9AC9BFEC
     Copy OK

Track  5

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\05. Genesis - Dodo , Lurker.wav

     Peak level 89.6 %
     Track quality 100.0 %
     Copy CRC CC8591C6
     Copy OK

Track  6

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\06. Genesis - Who Dunnit.wav

     Peak level 98.6 %
     Track quality 100.0 %
     Copy CRC 2EF70D44
     Copy OK

Track  7

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\07. Genesis - Man on the Corner.wav

     Peak level 82.4 %
     Track quality 100.0 %
     Copy CRC BD276332
     Copy OK

Track  8

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\08. Genesis - Like It Or Not.wav

     Peak level 93.8 %
     Track quality 100.0 %
     Copy CRC 54F9F4AD
     Copy OK

Track  9

     Filename C:\Users\Compaq Notebook\Desktop\TEST\09. Genesis - Another Record.wav

     Peak level 91.6 %
     Track quality 99.9 %
     Copy CRC AAE7127A
     Copy OK

No errors occurred

End of status report

It seems that the issue of EMI Swindon from the early 90s have the same mastering as well as issue of PDO. I found this EMI Swindon pressing last week, peaks levels are identical as PDO pressing.
Booklet aslo is the same as PDO issue. This edition probably appeared in the early 90s with the first series of re-releases Genesis albums. I attached pictures of disc and covers.

 

I had the whole SACD set. Sold it. The new mixes are ghastly; Compressed, limited, LOUD, and just plain unpleasant. Many others on this forum can, and have, attest to this as well.

 

A few comments on recent NC listening:

This, like the Trespass black triangle, is quite inferior to the UK V/C pressings. Quite a lot of top end boost.

Further info on this because another copy came through and I listened and analyzed. This one has clipping all over it. It is really a tinny mess, too. No idea what this one is all about but it should be avoided by anyone but completists. As I mentioned before and was the same with this copy, the inserts say Made In Japan and the disc has no indication as to where it was pressed. Frankly, I suspect this might be an early West German pressing, but whatever it is, it was seriously botched.

 

I have a V/C release of Seconds Out here (GECD 2001) and I'm trying to figure out where it was pressed. (It's the "Version 1" mastering in this thread.)

The booklet says "Made in West Germany", but nothing is indicated on the discs. The matrix on disc 1 is: GECD 2001 / 1+2 B

It came in a slim 2-CD case. No barcode on the inserts. I'm assuming this was pressed in Europe or the UK somewhere, but I'd like to know where, exactly. Anyone have this one?

 

I have the same copy: Matrix on disc 2 is :GECD 2001 / 3+4 B.

Must be a very early pressing; on the rear insert it says Record 1 and Record 2 (same on the CD labels) instead of CD 1 and CD 2 (my only other copy is the Definitive Edition..). The booklet includes lyrics and some black and white pictures of Phil doing his "tambourine number" . Bought from a German seller about a month ago. Where was it pressed? I'd like to know that too! My copy is in a fatbox case

 

Ha! This is funny...

I was going to make a remark about how strange it was that the back insert in the slim 2-CD case was printed on both sides. After reading your post, I thought, Hmmmm... Went and took a closer look at mine, and the "other side" of the back insert is, in fact, the front insert that would have been in a fatboy case. So now I get to find myself a new case for it and return it to its original, fatboy, form.

Yes, yours is the same as mine (same matrix for disc 2).

 

Hey! I have myself a copy of W&W (the one with 8 tracks). Just like the other versions, it's lacking bass. I merged Unquiet Slumbers... with Afterglow, and tried to de-emphasize with a cute little program called "WaveEmph".

For my surprise, it sounds better than the original. I was wondering if they forgot to insert PRE flags in it. Perhaps it's not another version, but an alternative EQ of 1st version, why not? (PRE-flagged UK Sonopress comes to mind)

Since there's no PRE flag in it, our best tool to check it are our ears. I could upload a sample, If you guys want me to.

 

Yes! This issue comes with a FAT Boy case. Someone probably replace broken box. I have this issue also and i think this must be an early Sonopress pressing. The matrices are very close/same to common Sonopress discs.

 

Genesis - Live (VJCP-23116 - 1991) - If it's like the others, this should match the Black Triangle and the Big Artist.

EAC:

100, 97, 100, 95.9, 97.6

I don't care for this mastering. Quite a lot of top end boost compared to the Sanyo Japan V/C. I can post a sample if anyone wishes, but this is not a mastering I'd bother worrying about unless you collect early Japanese pressings of the Genesis catalog.

 

Here is another Abacab:

Vertigo (blue swirl) 23PD-117 made in Japan. Released [89.3.5]

91.9% - 85.5% - 83.5% - 78.7% - 92.2% - 91.6% - 50.2% - 84.1% - 90.0%

 

I don't know if this was confirmed later in the thread but this is DEFINITELY a PDO Blackburn pressing, the one I just got from eBay has 'Printed in the UK' on the CD and in the booklet, but the dead giveaway is that it has the dreaded bronzing...

Matrix: CASCD1052 2896 980 01 #

I'm not sure if this one was preferred to the Nimbus/Swindon pressing or not, but I'm assuming all the copies of this mastering will be PDO Blackburn so the clock is presumably ticking for this particular version's existence!


[EDIT] Oh, and in the same package I also got the MOST bronzed CD I've ever seen which was disc 1 of Three Sides Live (disc 2 wasn't a lot better!)

 

Having said all of the above, I stumbled across a thread here yesterday suggesting that some PDO discs had a deliberate gold tint, which actually looks more like my Nursery Cryme.

Hopefully it's not about to bite the dust since it sounds rather good to my ears (certainly better than the abominable Sonopress CD which Jeff Carney quite rightly slated, and is now off to my local charity shop!

 

That was my understanding as well. Some CDs are more "yellow" than others...

 

See also: http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=147702

(sadly, some of the photos have since disappeared)

 

Yes, that was the thread! It is a shame about the photos of the Three Sides Live discs which were for sale, because I'd be interested to know if they were the same pressing as the one I just received (which may once have been gold but are now definitely bronzed to heck...)

However, my Nursery Cryme looks like the one posted there by Andrew S. so I'm hoping it's all good.

 

If you mean that early version of Nursery Cryme which just has the CASCD 1052 in the matrix and has digital clipping all over it, you might want to just toss that thing.

Man, nobody deserves to put up with that piece of crap.

 

My two discs are totally BRONZED! They are play fine, but i can make any copy, EAC freezee at 2nd track (each disc)!

Here's are the pictures of the box and the discs... No comments!

http://i51.tinypic.com/w18ztd.jpg
http://i51.tinypic.com/ehzq0w.jpg

 

Those look like the gold tinted CDs PDO was pressing just after the whole bronzing thing. I've put forth the idea that it may have been a way of hiding the bronzing until they could figure out a way to prevent their dye from bronzing, but that's just a guess. Anyway ... those don't look too bronzed to me. If EAC won't rip I don't think it's related to bronzing.

 

Offcourse, but those one are bronzed, my scanner make the discs to bright, here is a picture from Digital camera and the discs looks like they have a copper label!

 

I can't remember what the matrix was but it had 'MANUFACTURED IN WEST GERMANY BY SONOPRESS' round the plastic hub in kind of raised lettering.

I can't even check because I was as good as my word and donated it to the local British Heart Foundation shop.



Sounded awful.

 

Yours looks identical to mine except that mine also have 'Made in the UK' in the matrix...

It's hard to tell from your photos but you know it's definitely bronzing when the colour isn't consistent across the whole disc face!

My 3SL discs get darker towards the edges, whereas my Nursery Cryme is a very consistent gold-ish tint.