Finding The Best Sounding Genesis (Part 1), Album By Album...

The tape flaw was on the original LP and in response to another comment regarding this, I DON'T think this CD is poorly remastered. I trust my ears and on my system it sounds great (and I don't have to scour the globe looking for that "certain" pressing...)

 

I don't have all of the Genesis CDs mentioned here yet, but I'm surprised the Mastered By Nimbus V/C of Trick doesn't get mentioned here more often...it's some of the best sounding Genesis I've heard on CD, so far.

 

Don't worry about "scouring the globe," any earlier pressing of Foxtrot will beat the DE. Should take about 2 minutes.

 

To each their own.

 

The original gabriel era releases for Nursery Cryme and Foxtrot were on the Charisma label, distributed by Buddah. Buddah also released a double lp titled The Best Of Genesis, which contained both Nursery Cryme & Foxtrot. All 3 releases contain the Charisma label/Mad Hatter in the center

I forget why Trespass ended up on the ABC, and later, MCA label.

I'm glad I held on to these releases.

 

I also managed to track down the Japanese Atlantic release for Duke on vinyl, and it sounds better than the US Atlantic release.

 

A common but not convincing argument for those who might be seeking a good pressing of Foxtrot on CD.

For anyone who is unaware, the DE of Foxtrot has some of the weirdest no-noise and/or improper dolby decoding artifacts ever accomplished. Phil Elliott noted this here years ago, and I think samples were even posted at some point.

 

I will give this another listen tonight with this in mind. I do respect most of the opinions regarding remastering on this forum. I've learned a lot. However, the DE of Foxtrot was the 3rd time I purchased it (although the 1st time on CD). Sometimes I really get put off the idea of buying something again that I've played to death.

 

Sorry to have to break it to you, but that's not a Target design disc. Although quite often early pressings with the circular design will have the same mastering as the Target design disc.

Here's the site to check out for all the Target disc info you need.
http://www.ralphscomiccorner.com/cdjwg2.htm

 

I hear ya. Phil or Andreas first brought it up here. I think it was Phil. He pointed out that the dolby decoding or no-noise was so off that the hi-hat on "Watcher" is literally gating in and out on the DE.

 

Yep - it was me. I thought it was Dolby at first; but having heard it again recently, some of those hihats aren't gated out - they are actually *deleted*.

It's NoNoise.

Back then I thought that stuff was only used on sound effects CDs. I didn't think anyone would try to use single ended noise reduction on master tapes, or production/safety/flat dubs thereof.

You know, Dolby A was designed so that, when set up properly, you didn't get major pumping artifacts. With the Foxtrot DE, you've got those kind of artifacts right there, on a disc which was intended to be an improvement on what was available before. Well, I've heard two masterings which were commonly available on the Virgin/Charisma CD's prior to that, and both of them at the very least let you hear the whole drum kit .

 

Well I just listened to said Definitive Edition Remaster. I stand by what I originally thought. To me (and on my system) it sounds really good. I don't know what else to say. I know this album well. I don't want to go against anyone seemingly "in the know" but to these ears the Foxtrot I have sounds great. I'll be damned if I'm going to seek out another copy of a CD that I play once a year (but still love) In the words of the Family Stone: "different strokes for different folks, and so on and so on..."

 

johnny 99: At one point, I had almost all of the Virgin/Charisma Genesis albums on CD. The ones which I didn't have, I had the Atlantics of. When the remasters came out, I gave away almost all of them right after I went out and picked up the remasters. I never did an a/b on any of these titles. I figured since the artwork was terrible with the cropped covers and they were not remastered, there was no reason to hold on to them. What a mistake. After reading posts here about how many of the V/C titles sounded better than the remasters, I started looking for the discs all over again. With some patience, you will find them on Ebay and they are not expensive. None of them cost over $20 and many I got for under $10.

It's worth saying once again: find the Atlantic Japanese press of Duke. When you a/b that with the remaster, I guarantee you will be amazed at how great that old mastering is and the remaster will never go into your player again.

 

The Selling England by the Lb. and Wind und Wuthering Atlantic/Atco original pressings are the same as the V/Cs. Identical.

I have both first pressings on Atlantic/ATCO.

SEBTL is made by BMG Sonopress and WAW is made by Sanyo Japan. Both have Virgin Charisma cat nos. in the matricies, and low and behold, V/C's issues were made in those plants!

Same disc, different label. Not just same master, same DISC.

Later pressings are made in USA by WEA Mfg from these masters.

Original Atlantic CDs of Genesis S/T, ATTWT, Abacab, all made by Polygram/PDO WG first pressings have the same masters as the Charismas, since Charisma was distributed by PolyGram/Phonogram in Europe when the CDs came out. Polygram simply made target label CDs for Atlantic.

When JVC Victor and later WEA Mfg. started replicating these CDs, they may have dropped some dBs, but these are the same masters.

 

Hi Barry! Thanks for answering! It's too bad to hear you remastered these albsm and then nothing came of it

 

I have the Atco's of "Trick" and "Wind" and they both sound good to me and I have no interest in upgrading to the DE's.

I also have a Atlantic "Three Sides Live" made in Japan by Daio Kosan, Co, LTD for the US market. Mastered by Barry I have only ever listened to "Side 4" but the sound is great! Not sure why I have this CD though if I never listen to the whole thing.

Pat

 

Well, in the case of Trick, it would be a "downgrade" to the DE, not an upgrade.

The original Atco of Wind is another matter. The DE is a *massive* upgrade. It actually has that little thing called bottom end.

 

No Noise can do wonders to a tambourine or other percussion....and phased out sax solos....ugh.

 

I'm not interested in Duke. I just wrote that I find the DE Remaster of Foxtrot to be adequate for me. I like it and that's all I wanted to convey. I wouldn't play it much because I've heard it a lot in the past. I was shocked at how good my copy sounded to ME. There is no love at all for the DE Remasters here and to me Foxtrot, Selling England... and The Lamb... are fine.

 

Do you agree that the DE remasters of Foxtrot and Selling England have noise reduction? Would you say that you like some noise reduction?

 

I don't know. I don't have tin ears and the darn thing sounds fine to me. I hear nice highs and it sounds better than the LP ever did. Sue me! I've been listening to this album since '76. I feel I'm a good judge of it. We must all be given the freedom to enjoy a particular version of a CD without being called into question on every detail. I like the sound of it. I've purchased it 3 times, no more. I don't mean to offend anyone, I just like the DE remastered Foxtrot!!!! That's all...

 

The orig. UK Virgin/Charisma CD of Nursery Cryme is bass heavy. Otherwise, it sounds pretty good to me. And not an easy disc to find.

 

I wasn't trying to suggest that the remasters are horrible. I don't think they are. First off, they don't sound any louder than the original cd releases which is a good thing. With some of the titles, I like the older version more. I only wanted to point out that if you are looking for the older version, they are not that hard to find. Either way, it's the music that's important.

 

I bought a US CD of Duke (non-remastered) and even though the Charisma CD sounds great the standard US CD is better. The midrange is fuller, the low end isn't as thin and the top end isn't quite as crispy. All positive things. Thanks for recommending it Jeff.

 

You bet, Jaime.

I wonder if it a secret Diament remaster?

Btw, the early Japan for US Atlantics match the Charisma. The WEA pressed US Atlantics are the best I've heard for this one.