Emerson Lake And Palmer 'Brain Salad Surgery' SACD

1.7 cents. Should get rounded off to 2 cents. Then you can double your money walking through any parking lot.

 

Probably costs more to create the refund process it and send a mail than you got back. still a promise is a promise.

 

Not to de-rail this thread, but here's a post from an old discussion: http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showpost.php?p=1337154&postcount=67

Now I have the following:

Rhino R2 72459 (c)(p) 1996
Matrix = WEA mfg. Y16573 3 R2 72459-2 RE-1 01 M1S4

Castle CMRCD201 (c)(p) 2001
Matrix = CMRCD201 SANCTUARY RECORDS *26972 www.vdcgroup.com

While early copies of the Castle contained a wrong mix, I believe I have the corrected one. Here are the EAC levels:

Rhino: 100.0 % - 100.0 % - 82.7 % - 84.8 % | Karn = (95.0 % - 99.5 % - 81.1 % - 84.7 %) | bonus = 94.6 %

Castle: 98.8 % - 98.8 % - 81.8 % - 83.8 % | Karn = 98.3 % | bonus = 93.3 % - 73.2 % - 92.6 %

A little explanation: Karn Evil 9 is one track on the Castle, four tracks on the Rhino, and the bonus tracks are not common! Are they related? Look at this:

100/98.8 x Castle = 100.0 % - 100.0 % - 82.794 % - 84.818 % | Karn = 99.494 %

EAC reports only the peak values, so the highest level for Karn on the Rhino is 99.5%!

Listening to both discs on identical CD players and switching between them on my Meitner/EMM Labs pre-amp (which has indepedent level settings for each input) and they sound identical to me.

If someone has the Victory version, we should be able to determine which copy has been slightly level adjusted. I'm surprised that Pioneer reported exact cancellation in his post linked above, but anything is possible when masters get re-used.

 

I've been reading this thread and I am mystified. Can someone tell me if the SACD is worth it? What is the surround mix on it, the one on the DVD-A? And, what is the stereo mix on it?

Thanks in advance for any clear reply.

 

Can't comment yet because I haven't recieved it.

 

My order from Amazon/uk came in today but I won't have a chance to listen to it tonight. Nice packaging.

 

Got mine today as well. Holding off on comments about the audio, but there are a couple typos in the booklet I find amusing - Manticore is mistyped as Manicure in one instance and the track "When The Apple Blossoms Bloom In The Windmills Of Your Mind I'll Be Your Valentine" reads "When The Apple Blossoms Bloom In The Windmills Of Your Mind I'll Be Your Valentine Time". Some intrepid soul has also added this to the CDDB database so be on the lookout.

 

I got mine from Amazon UK the other day. Oddly, the packaging states the third disc is a DVD with a 5.1 mix, although the disc is definately an SACD!

The SACD has been placed in the wallet that holds the booklet, whereas the CD's are packaged with conventional trays.

 

There are lots of typo errors throughout. What is "5.1 STS" for instance. Also the SACD disc is a hybrid soyou have the original stereo album on the CD layer. So why have disc one which is just the stereo album on CD! Also a bugger to get the disc and booklet out of the side opening.

Its stated that the remastering is by Jospech Palmacio. This has been copied from the the last re-issue of this disc. The remastering is by Paschal Byrne. Good job too. Only my opinion of course!

 

I think it's supposed to read that it's the "DVD 5.1 mix" meaning the same mix used on the DVD-A that came out in 2000.

the whole thing is curiously sloppy, there should either be a 3rd tray for the 3rd disc a la the Deluxe London Calling set, or make it a 2 disc set, (as the current 1st disc is not needed), and make both discs SACD Hybrids.

 

Will someone please comment on the sound qaality of the SACD?
Thanks.

 

Yes, that is what I am really curious about.

 

Now that it is out, can it be confirmed that the SACD has a 2 Channel as well as a 5.1 ?

Thanks, Rick

 

I'll listen to the SACD when I get home, but I did just discover that the disc 1 CD and the disc 3 SACD redbook layer of the album are different masterings


SACD redbook

Track | Start | Length | Start sector | End sector
---------------------------------------------------------
1 | 0:00.00 | 2:45.73 | 0 | 12447
2 | 2:45.73 | 7:22.61 | 12448 | 45658
3 | 10:08.59 | 2:53.21 | 45659 | 58654
4 | 13:02.05 | 2:21.11 | 58655 | 69240
5 | 15:23.16 | 8:34.74 | 69241 | 107864
6 | 23:58.15 | 4:48.11 | 107865 | 129475
7 | 28:46.26 | 7:07.12 | 129476 | 161512
8 | 35:53.38 | 9:05.27 | 161513 | 202414


Track 1
Peak level 97.5 %
Track 2
Peak level 95.4 %
Track 3
Peak level 93.2 %
Track 4
Peak level 93.9 %
Track 5
Peak level 94.1 %
Track 6
Peak level 94.0 %
Track 7
Peak level 93.4 %
Track 8
Peak level 94.0 %

CD

Track | Start | Length | Start sector | End sector
---------------------------------------------------------
1 | 0:00.00 | 2:45.73 | 0 | 12447
2 | 2:45.73 | 7:22.45 | 12448 | 45642
3 | 10:08.43 | 2:53.19 | 45643 | 58636
4 | 13:01.62 | 2:21.29 | 58637 | 69240
5 | 15:23.16 | 8:34.74 | 69241 | 107864
6 | 23:58.15 | 4:48.11 | 107865 | 129475
7 | 28:46.26 | 7:07.12 | 129476 | 161512
8 | 35:53.38 | 9:05.27 | 161513 | 202414


Track 1
Peak level 98.8 %
Track 2
Peak level 98.8 %
Track 3
Peak level 98.8 %
Track 4
Peak level 98.8 %
Track 5
Peak level 98.8 %
Track 6
Peak level 98.8 %
Track 7
Peak level 98.8 %
Track 8
Peak level 98.8 %

 

Interesting - this package uses the Universal "DeLuxe Edition" packaging, yet it's on Sanctuary.

Do they use the correct stereo mixes, or persist with the wrong ones a la the Shout! Factory BSS CD?

 

I'll get the levels tomorrow on the Shout! Factory edition, should be interesting.

 

AFAIK Sanctuary is part of Universal these days.

They used the right mix this time, and i like Byrne's re-mastering on this one. It would be nice to hear what other people think about it.
There are some typos and errors in the liner notes as somebody mentioned before and the second disc is pretty useless. But anyway, i won't regret buying this (i did with the Shout!'s fiasco edition).

 

It's news to me that the Shout Factory release used the "wrong mix."

I never bothered picking it up, but despite numerous complaints about that CD I don't recall this being one of them.

 

The still unanswered question is why can't there be a surround sound mix of this album using the correct vocal takes? Just like Rhino's DVD-A, the surround mix presented on Sanctuary's SACD uses the alternate lead vocals.

 

I think Shout! is right mix, but bad source tape. Karn Evil 9 is so bad that it's almost hard to say if it's the right or wrong mix.

It's strange why they used wrong vox tracks for the DVD-A in the first place.

 

The Shout factory uses the correct mix - it was the first Sanctuary issue that used the wrong mix. The SF Brain Salad Surgery sounds OK to me - there are variations in the sound quality during Karn Evil 9 just like there were on the original Manticore UK vinyl due to the different recording engineers used during the taping of that epic. Chris Kimsey recorded Karn Evil 9 First Impression and Geoff Young was engineer for the remainder of the album (see the booklet included with the CD or the poster included with the original album). The Victory and Rhino CDs were mastered by Joe Palmaccio and Bill Inglot respectively so as to reduce the audible differences during the parts of Karn Evil 9, whereas it sounds like the differences were left as they were by Shout Factory mastering engineer Mark Chalecki.

 

The Rhino is the same Palmaccio remastering as the Victory. The Inglot credit inside is just a mistake.

 

the S!F mastering is different than both of the redbook masterings on this deluxe edition. While I didn't seriously listen to the SACD last night I did find out it has both 5.1 and stereo (as opposed to the Rhino DVD-A which despite claims on the package of a high res stereo version only has a 5.1 mix on the DVD-A portion and a Dolby surround on the DVD-V portion).

The Deluxe Edition SACD claims a total time of 49:47 with KE9 1.1 being 13:24 this is a typo and represents the combined times of KE9 1.1 and KE9 1.2

here's the EAC info for the S!F remaster

Track | Start | Length | Start sector | End sector
---------------------------------------------------------
1 | 0:00.00 | 2:44.12 | 0 | 12311
2 | 2:44.12 | 7:22.50 | 12312 | 45511
3 | 10:06.62 | 2:53.10 | 45512 | 58496
4 | 12:59.72 | 2:21.23 | 58497 | 69094
5 | 15:21.20 | 8:37.00 | 69095 | 107869
6 | 23:58.20 | 4:46.07 | 107870 | 129326
7 | 28:44.27 | 7:06.60 | 129327 | 161336
8 | 35:51.12 | 9:12.65 | 161337 | 202801



Track 1
Peak level 97.0 %
Track 2
Peak level 94.6 %
Track 3
Peak level 88.5 %
Track 4
Peak level 94.5 %
Track 5
Peak level 94.0 %
Track 6
Peak level 94.7 %
Track 7
Peak level 94.3 %
Track 8
Peak level 94.5 %

 

I don't know whether folks are concerned about the presence of a stereo program on any other upcoming SACDs, but, if it helps to allay fears, the SACD Scarlet Book specification was changed after the release of one or two classical M-ch only titles to make it mandatory for there to be a stereo version on the disc.

 

I'm glad you said that, Jeff, as I always thought they sounded too similar. Maybe there was a remastering credit given for the different non-album material? I can't remember what was on the Victory.