A shame we can't compile a list of HAECO-CSG vinyl....we could ask Craig to whip up a Skull'n'Crossbones icon for such threads....
"My vintage LP of the Association's Greatest Hits was processed with CSG, and sadly when Warners reissued it on CD in the 80's, they used the same processed master. It was a Revelation to hear the original stereo masters on the Japanese reissues and the Rhino 2-CD comp" So that's why that CD sounds like it does. It's the only Association CD I own right now and I always thought it was the result of too many bounces in the recordings to layer the vocals, much like the Mamas & Papas recordings. Bob.
Guys, I'm a bit confused. I bought the Melody movie soundtrack on vinyl and also the Simon and Garfunkel The Graduate soundtrack vinyl. They both have the "mono" sticker but to my annoyance, they play in stereo. So I assumed the CSN record that started this thread would play in stereo. What the hell is going on?
Much of the Association's work was produced and recorded by "Bones" Howe who also recorded the Mamas & Papas and Fifth Dimension. Get the Rhino "Just The Right Sound" compilation and toss that old Warners CD in the trash. I have a MGM 45 of Herman's Hermits' "Sleepy Joe" and its a CSG processed FAKE Stereo master! What the heck were those remastering bums at MGM thinking? (MGM's LP mastering is some of the worst of the late 60's/early 70's)
Hi Steve, That's a "Hey Mabel, Another Black Label" (code for I'll drink to that). CSG made lots of records into muck and mud. Out of phase indeed. What's wrong with regular mono?
Not to hijack the thread for the Association but those Japanese reissues sound at least as good or better than the Rhino 2-CD comp? I'm thinking of picking them up for the mono single versions as bonus tracks. Bob.
If you dont want the extra bonus tracks (mono versions, single-only cuts) you could pick up the Collector's Choice CD's, which I think use the same remasters and are much cheaper than the Japanese Imports. They are basic reproductions of the original albums.
I hate CSG!!! I got rid of every album in my collection with it!! Who ever thought this was a good idea they should be beaten!!
If it's a 90 degree phase shift applied to one channel then you could make a digital copy of it and fix it in software, or would be possible to fix it in analogue with clever use of an SQ decoder. Both neither option especially convenient though.
I always assumed it was the CSG Stereo signal folded to mono. But whatever it was, didn't do anything for sound quality....
Yes, Wheels Of Fire. Which makes Steve's work on the DCC releases even more remarkable. He couldn't fix the drum sound on this album, but aside from that, the sound is great!
Only a cartain number of songs on WHEELS OF FIRE were CSG. Give a listen and let me know which ones.. Impress me.. Hint: Listen on cans.
I'd rather stick a vacuum cleaner hose on each ear! (Funny how out of phase signals feel that way on the ears! )
I do know "White Room" was one of the CSG processed songs. That song always had a weird sound to it. Of course I always though it was because of the way the song was recored. Didn't think it was due to processing. I do know Sergio Mendes' "Fool On The Hill" album on A&M records had a wonky sound to it. I did a needle drop of that one. Real funky in places.
A few A&M albums did, around that same time: Fool did, as did the follow-up Crystal Illusions. The Butch Cassidy soundtrack suffers from it (any time you hear a stereo version of "Raindrops Keep Falling On My Head", it's the CSG version), as does the Tijuana Brass The Brass Are Comin' album.
Sergio Mendes' "Ye-Me-Le" also suffers from the dreaded CSG processing. It was really disappointing to see that Universal reissued "Fool On The Hill" on CD and it sounds exactly like the original LP!!! Would it have been such a hardship to pull the multitracks out and give it a new stereo remix?
Here's my assessment: "White Room" - I know this was CGS, but I still went through the song a couple of times. Most noticeable to me, is at the begin of the song. Also the vocals are not at the same level in both channels. "Sitting On Top Of The World" - This one, the jury is still out on. I don't know if its the grungy sounding guitar of Eric Clapton or what. It just has a processed sound to me. I'm guessing here. "Politician" - Here, Jack Bruce's vocals sound different in each channel. One channel is more pronounced with the vocals. Also Ginger Baker's cymbals has a tiny and phasy sound to them. "Those Were The Days" - Again, Ginger's cymbals sound different here than the rest of the album. Also, when the bells come in, they just don't sound right. Something is going on there. The vocals (like all of the songs, I picked) have a different level to them, between the channels. "Born Under A Bad Sign" - Here the tambourine and cymbals have a tiny, thin sound to them. Jack's bass sounds totally different on this song than it does on the other tracks. It definitely has the sound of processing to it. And, again the vocals tell me something. The reason why I didn't pick the other songs is; they all had a common denominator. They sounded wider, cleaner and most importantly, the vocals were dead center with the mix. That's my story and I'm sticking to it!
