Bowie's mix of Raw Power

I correct something I said up there, apparently, Iggy's voice is triple tracked on the original, so it might be fair to assume Iggy used different takes than Bowie for his own mix, hence the many differences on the singing and the way the words are spouted out. Guess he comped the tracks to make one "definitive" for each song, rather than double or triple tracking them.
Iggy did said in interviews at the time that Sony were going to remix, with or without his involvement.

Raw Power, Bowie version, is one of the most influential albums of the seventies, aped by thousands of 76-79 punk bands. You can't say Bowie missed the mix : it was spot on what thousands wanted to hear in these times of Yes, ELO and Eagles stuff. I think it helped move the Stooges from an obscure cult punk band, to the godfathers of a movement.

It gave Iggy credentials that, doubled with the respective issues of The Idiot and Lust For Life, gave his career a much needed shot in the arm, and helped him through very turbulent times, into the hit and miss solo career we know.

 

Frankly, the remix CD is so compressed and distorted that it is hard to tell.

Tim

 

I agree Mike. I think the Bowie mix is terrible. The remix obviously has serious problems but at least it has some balls. The Bowie mix sounds like you are on the second floor and a band playing is playing in the basement. The vocals sit with the band much better on the remix. On the Bowie they sound like they were recorded in a different studio a mile away from the band. I think the drier sound of the remix helps. The Bowie also has no bass whatsoever. I Need Somebody on the remix doesn't sound that bad (save for the extreme limiting). I really don't think it was that bad of a recording. Of course the mastering on the remix is awful. I hate how shrill James' guitar is..

 

I don't know, in the liner notes Iggy said he made the remix engineers put everything "in the red" and they resisted.

 

Oh, to just put down the limiter 2db down the +114db it was originally on, is not what I call resisting
I think the end results were probably what these guys wanted in the first place. Any more sensible engineer / mastering wizard, would probably have showed Iggy that "when there is no quiet, there is no loud".

 

Again, or the 180g vinyl.

 

actually, it's a 160g one. Or so they say on simply vinyl page, where they omit to say what mix is on the vinyl, though.

 

Ok, fair enough. It's the Bowie mix. I'm 100 percent positive on that.

 

Wasn't being mean, just precise.
Call it crazy, but in france, you can download the Bowie Mix on Itunes !

The sleeve is clearly the original sleeve, with washed out colors and the Stooges logo on the front.

http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?id=14846077&s=143442

I checked US/UK itunes, and it's not there. Worst, UK features two versions, one with and one without logo, but they both are the Iggy mix

 

mixes of raw power

The original mix of Raw Power always seemed underwhelming and muffled to me. I still have a promo copy obtained directly from a Columbia promo man, the day it was released. Seeing the band a few months later convinced me that the mix was on the tame, lame side. Four years later, I was able to acquire a dutch CBS, mid-priced import of Raw Power, which is clearly a different mix, and though not quite loud enough for my taste, an improvement over the original american release. I also have a 45 of Search And Destroy and Penetration, and both are slightly different, especially Penetration, than aany lp or CD release I've heard. As far as the CBS remaster by the Iggster himself, I love it. It is brutal, just as those tunes were live.

 

Hi Paul

Are you speaking of the 1977 Holland pressing ? It does sound different, accounting to why many people claims to this day they were two different mixes released previous the Iggy remix. But was it, or just cleverly mastered (ie not the same mastering or presses) ?!

 

to seventeen

Yes, I bought the dutch CBS pressing of Raw Power through Peters International either in 1977 or 1978...I have no way of knowing if it is clearly a different mix, but it certainly sounds like it. The few people I know who have this disc agree; or swear that it IS a different mix...it certainly is possible that american Columbia sent dutch CBS something that was in the can that was not reviewed...and maybe this forum will solve our puzzle. Nonetheless, despite still owning my original promo, I stopped playing it after acquiring this dutch pressing, as it really does sound better to me.

 

I discovered Raw Power in 1977, with this very same pressing, and so far, it's true that I didn't find another pressing sounding as good and as great as it.
(I was born in 1965, so pardon me for not hearing the Stooges when they first came out, I was busy listening to the Beatles instead er, much more easy to get the records right ?!).
It would be cool if people who have both the may 1973 and may 1977 pressings could compare at home. Maybe the mastering was hotter or something. ?
I know several musicians from 1976 era punk bands, who still swear to this day that no original CD of Raw Power holds the "original" mix (which to them is the 1977 repress), and I suspect the old CDs have the 1973 release mix, while the 1977 version is something else.

 

I'm wondering about something now. I first bought Raw Power in late 1977 when it was reissued because of the beginning of the punk scene here in Canada. The version I got was obviously on Columbia but I always remember liking it and not thinking it was all that bad sound wise. Sure it was rough and primitive etc... but we just cranked it until it sounder as loud as all our other faves of that time (Ramones first 2; 1st Clash; The Sex Pistol's imported album...) Could it be that our Canadian version of that reissue was improved a bit sonically from the orig. 1973 version??? I sure wish I still had that LP.

 

Everyone raves about how much the original album influenced the class of 77... thing is, most punters punkers bought the 77 re-release, not the original (as I did), so it might be that either it was a hotter, better mastered version, or maybe an alternate one ? After meeting 4 different original band members from 77 bands who all, independently claimed to me there are two Bowie Mix of Raw Power out there (not speaking about the Bomp Rough Power CD), it dawned on me they might not all be on crack (thought some clearly digested much worse kind of legal pills), and may be right.
In my memories, that album is a killer (original 77 pressing then) mean, sonically atomic bomb machine, sounding bigger and better than either the original 80's bowie mix CDs or the 97 remix.

 

I think we've uncovered something here... I am now almost convinced that when Raw Power was re-released is 77, it was "loudened" up a bit. I never thought of this until now, but it's making sense. I had the 1991 CD in my possession very briefly and it sounded awful to me. Maybe I had a better version originally on vinyl from 77. Very interesting...

 

is the original vinyl prefix kc or pc? i should know this, but now i can't remember.

 

KC

 

thanks jeff.

 

so i don't know if this has been covered, and if so, my apologies. but in my never ending quest to replace my long ago stupid selling of my original raw power, i bought one off ebay with a kc prefix. however, it's a reissue with sony/bmg on the label. but when i looked in the runout grooves, it has "rml" on both sides. isn't that ludwig? i haven't played it yet but plan on cleaning and playing later on tonight, but i wasn't aware that ludwig, if that's in fact his inscription, did raw power.

any thoughts?

 

after a search, maybe this was done by forum member rob loverde? maybe he'll comment?

 

I like reissue LP more than the original vinyl...it's smoother and easier to listen to. Plus, it has more bass.

 

Yes, I mastered RAW POWER for vinyl LP. If you see something that has RML or RMLoVerde in the lead-out groove, it's me.

 

Did you master the 180g reissue as well?

 

I can't say for sure. I do know that I mastered it for vinyl and if you see my signature, it's a sure thing.

But, once I cut the lacquers, I don't always know what they use them for.

So, that 180-gram vinyl could be me, it may not. Sorry I can't be more helpful than that...