Beatles box set coming Nov. 16

I'm not spending my money on this garbage, "Dexterized" or not. Capitol sure knows how to make hardcore Beatles fans bend over so they can be screwed. Well, I'm not falling for it this time.

 

Whoa there buddy, calm down. You don't have to like it. I don't think they're screwing anybody. If you don't like it, don't buy it. We barely know anything about it yet anyway.

 

...hardcore fans have been asking for these for years, no rip here...just finally getting what we want...oh, by the way, the Bootleg Beat American LP series was repressed 4 times! Someone was buying them at $25.00 a pop!...and that doesn't include the tons of others that released them..now that's a RIP ...Hopefully they'll give us what we want this time THE ORIGINAL straight without no correction...leave the Dex alone! Yea, Yea, Yea!...The Beatles Are Coming! The Beatles Are coming! very soon!

 

Meet The Beatles-Mono-Fold-Down
betales second album-Mono
Beatles 65-Mono
Something New-Mono
The Early Beatles-Mono-Fold-Down...

...the Beatles wanted to conquer America more than anything and they did that very well indeed! The US Versions HELPED in a huge way...What always miffed me, was the fact that they were not happy with the US versions of their LP's, YET they sure enjoyed the Millions upon Millions of dollars generated by these LP's...The punch and added extra mush added to the early release gave 'em that extra push, especially on a AM pocket Radio!

 

Thanks for the response ok, so at least B65 and SN will have "unique" mono mixes (i.e. not fold-down), and I'm assuming they're the UK mono mixes but Dexterized?

There is a point that's been on my mind lately, and it is this; is it possible that the Beatles would have flopped in the US without the Americanization (i.e. repackaging and Dexterizing) of their work? I mean, Capitol was a hugely successful label, and they sure knew their audience. What did we as teeny-boppers know back then, did any of us go **** there's way too much reverb on that track? Or did we love the music unconditionally? For me it was the latter. Knowing what I know now, of course I grouse and moan Dexter this and repackaging that, but there is the possibility that Capitol actually was very savvy in their marketing of the band. Just something that's been on my mind lately...

 

Why would they skip the US "Hard Day's Night"? Does United Artists (I forget who just bought them...Sony???) still have any ownership? I don't get it.

 

I know bashing Dave Dexter Jr. is like a recreational sport for Beatles' fans, but I gotta say, I think he gets a bit of a bad rap. IMO, his "crimes" are only criminal in hindsight; at the time, he was just a guy with a job to do, and his job was to move units, not to sabotage the sacred perfection of the Fab Four.

Was he an older guy who didn't "get" the Beatles? Sure. Did he mess with the sound? Yep. But people act like he killed every track he touched, which simply isn't true. Hell yeah, "I Feel Fine" and "She's A Woman" are abominations, but y'know what -- those are the WORST examples among dozens that are more or less harmless. In fact, lot of the more subtle Dexterizations did what I imagine he wanted them to do -- add a little "punch" and fatten up the sound of this odd British rock group that his bosses shoved on him after he had rejected them three times. We forget that the phrase "British rock group" was almost laughable in 1963; Dexter was probably convinced he had a turkey on his hands. Once he was proved wrong, his "velvet touch" got a lot lighter, to my ears (with the exception of the single mentioned above). After the 1964 onslaught, there is less rechanneling, more true stereo, and less superfluous reverb. By 1965, aside from the chopping up of the "real" albums -- which is offensive now, but a common practice back then -- the U.S. LPs sound OK to me. But then, I'm not an audiophile, so feel free to correct me, but please don't flame...

The issue of this supposed box set raises a lot of thorny issues. I agree with everyone who says that if they don't use the Dexter tapes, there is NO point in releasing the box at all. Then again, there's something admittedly perverse about remastering a 3rd generation tape copy of a folded down mono mix of a rechanneled stereo track. But don't music lovers always say that we should err on the side of preserving history? When EMI "fixed" the drop out in "Day Tripper" at first I thought it was cool that that "problem" would finally be "made right" -- and gee, what attention to detail for them to even take the time! But after awhile, it started to annoy me, because I was used to it -- and you know, it never really was a problem in the first place.

Sometimes, I think it's possible to love the Beatles too much. We want to put them in a glass case with our $300 mint mono UK Revolver and bow down in awe of them. But once upon a time they were just fun and nothing more. Paul loves to tell the story of how when things got tense with John, he would pull his glasses down his nose, peer over them and say "It's just me, you know." I miss a bit of that every once in a while.

Dave Dexter didn't know he was supposed to be preserving "art" ... you know what he was? He was the guy in the snack booth at the schoolyard carnival. He took 2 cents worth of sugar, whipped it into cotton candy, and sold it to kids for 2 bucks. And he sold a buttload of cotton candy. He did his job as he knew it. It was only later that we discovered that the sugar was precious. Fans of the US albums -- buy the box set if you want to remember when the Beatles were just the best damn cotton candy you ever tasted.

Sean Murdock

 

Really? From my perspective, it seems as if "hardcore fans" have been asking for sensibly-arranged two-discs versions of the albums which collect mono/stereo/alt. mixes on a sensible two discs. Hardcore fans have also been clamoring for more outtakes and unreleased songs.

I don't think many "hardcore fans" care too much about (potentially) super-expensive reissues of nostalgia pieces. "Hardcore fans" have had access to these for *years*...heck, the Japanese "Deluxe Something New" disc has some of the best sounding first-four-in-stereo stuff I've ever heard! That this constitutes our yearly-Beatles release is incredibly frustrating. While it doesn't necessarily negate its possibility of release, I feel a "Let It Be" DVD slowly slipping away...

 

Errr, Lets see how the sales figures tally up...

Oh yea, I have every available American LP boot release...I'm still yearning for this official release...we first generation Beatlemaniacs are very nostalgic...

..and I almost forgot, there is a world of difference between First Generation "Hardcore Fans" than later Generation "Hardcore Fans"...being there, sorry, in this case you had to be to fully understand the feeling..Yes David, we know the UK are better, it's not the point, it's all about feeling and emotion...I get teary eyed when I hear the Dex "You Can't Do That" and just about all the rest of the early American Beatles LP's...memories flood my mind with bliss...

 

This is certainly one of the most polarizing threads we've had in some time. I grew up with the American albums too and remember only too well thinking about my British Beatle friends and their access to the real deal (the full albums) while we were stuck with the butchered versions. If these are mastered well, I will probably have to plunk down the dough but, until then, I think this is still an odd idea. With the current state of the Beatles catalog presently in the dark ages compared with some other "big acts", it would make more sense to initiate a proper catalog overhaul before issuing this box. But then again, when did Apple ever do things sensibly?

 

Surely we've seen all this before with RCA cashing in to the max on Elvis 'product' before the 50-year copyright expires. Capitol are obviously preparing to cash in on The Beatles 'product' in a similar manner. Expect to see lots more of this (with lots of other '60s stars, too) over the next 10 years or so!

 

A fantastic post.

 

I am glad the Dexterized versions are coming out, especially if we're getting both stereo/mono versions. It's not replacing the UK versions, just more variety which is what we Beatle fans have been asking for. And I agree with the earlier poster that if this sells well, that will send a good signal to Apple that just maybe a set of mono/stereo remastered UK CDs will sell even better than stereo only.

 

Why bother. Hmmm...better sound?

 

I don't understand all of the complaining.

The American LPs - cover art, sequencing, and Dexterization - are part of the Beatles history. IMO, this alone justifies their official release. And as far as bootlegs go - well, a lot of us prefer to avoid bootlegs altogether (Smile excluded), and it's not like you can stop by your local Tower to pick up the latest boots.

If this boxed set bugs you, or you feel it's a rip-off, don't buy it. If enough people feel that way I'm sure we won't see anymore releases like it. Personally, I'm really looking forward to it and I hope they release "Yesterday And Today" (w/butcher cover!) and "Rubber Soul" at some point as well.

- joe s

 

Ditto. Well put, Sean.

 

I wish I had written this. Nice job. You captured my sentiments exactly.

Chris

 

Great Post about Dave Dexter, and I couldnt agree more.

For 1964 American Radio, those UK masters WERE too thin and just didnt sound "right" for the American Market. So Dave used the only tools available then, some reverb , and EQ to make The Beatles a bit more in line with the rest of the records released at that time. I STILL say the Dexter 'Beatles 65" is the best one, the music on that Lp greatly benefits from the Dexter treatment. Sounds full and thick.

Keep in mind also, that several Capitol executives listed to The Beatles during the promtion meetings and "decided" that the drums were not right for American radio, and that the whold sound needed "fixing". I know this for a fact, that the sales dept complained about that. This may be the whole basis (as I 've always thought) for Bernard Purdies story about him overdubbing driums on 21 Beatles tracks. He probably DID do that session, but his versions were never used, probably due to Brian Epstiens screams, which could be heard across the Atlantic without a telephone, if you knew Epstien. Far fetched? Sure? Could it be true? Absolutely.

 

Sorry for the typos......still early AM here in NY!!

 

Hi Mikey. Problem with Purdie's story is that all the AFM Union paperwork still exists and the only session he ever did that was connected to the Beatles was overdubbing drums on some of the 1961 Polydor session recordings when they were released in the U.S. in 1964. His claim is either a hazy memory, a willful exaggeration or a bit of both.

 

Hi MIkey,

I agree completely, and I'll bet the Crapitol folks first listened to the Vee-Jay and Swan singles of Please Please Me and She Loves You before deciding that was how the US singles should sound. Those 45s have that big, fat, full sound that was sorely lacking in the UK releases. Who is left who might know the answer?

GM

 

It's a well known fact that the suits at Capitol were so out of touch with what was going on that they passed, not once but three times, on releasing the early Beatle singles. Their loss was V-Jay and Swan's gain at the time.