Best Digital Versions of Emerson, Lake, and Palmer

[timw]

Originally Posted by Jamie Tate

You bet. I LOVE the sound of the drums on Fragile. Really clear and present. Did you know he used the same mic on the snare drum and the vocals back then. Weird.

Unreal! I didn't know that! I know we're getting off topic here but when u mentioned Eddie Offord, it sure brought back memories! The guy had some amazing recording techniques. You could pretty much tell it was an Offord mix when u heard it! Considering the equipment he had to work with back then...it still amazes me what he could do. He also mixed the 1st ELP album right??? How about that bass line that hits when he segues out of Palmer's solo in the track "Tank" back into the Emerson/Palmer jam of the song!!! I've come close to blowing many a woofer with this track!
Also, How about when Yes' CTTE kicks in after the quiet birds & water sound FX intro??? Pretty damn dynamic for vinyl!!!!

[tomcat]

Originally Posted by Claus

Rhino's BSS remaster has a warm full sound... the remix sounds too clean for me!

... and it lacks some reverb on the vocals... take the "Atlantic Years" 2CD for "Still... You Turn Me On".

[93curr]

there was a Victory 'Welcome Back'? wow. I never saw one. apart from the Japanese Atlantic, the first one I saw was the Rhino.

and I can guarantee that the first Victory edition of 'BSS' is different from the second, digipak edition, in addition to the re-connected Karns. the digipak being the (IMHO) superior of the two.

say, anybody else think that the 'Mass" segment from 'Tarkus' sounds just like the theme from 'NewsRadio'?

[Jeff Carney]

Originally Posted by Claus

The Castle/Sanctuary remaster of Brain Salad Surgery is a remix!!! Not the same what Rhino used....

That was corrected long ago. The CD was originally issued by Castle (by mistake, I think) with a different mix. It might have been from the DVD-A mix, but anyway, this was corrected on later pressings.

[Jeff Carney]

Originally Posted by Jamie Tate

I have an early Trilogy CD and it sounds amazing. Great Eddie Offord mixes.

If you are referring to the original Atalntic issue then I would differ on this, Jaime. I just picked this up over the weekend and while I agree with the general consensus around here that the Atlantic of the first (s/t) album is really nice, their issue of _Trilogy_ is terrible, IMO. Way, way too bright and yet the bottom end is too boomy also! If I didn't know better I'd think they got hold of a tape made with smiley-face EQ and then transferred it to digital! What their tape source was I have no idea but if my memory serves the Rhino and Castle (same mastering, iirc) blow this one completely out of the water. I'll A/B later tonight and confirm.

[Jeff Carney]

Originally Posted by antonkk

Get the japanese K2s for the first 5 studio albums. Beautiful mini-vinyl packaging and amazing sound!

Have to disagree here except for _Tarkus_ and _Brain Salad Surgery_. BSS sounds remarkably similar in K2 form to the Castle issue (with the right mix). I think the _Tarkus_ K2 has goosed bass but it sounds pretty damn good. The _Trilogy_ K2 is, IMO, the worst of the lot. It is utterly stripped of so much treble that it sounds like a 5th gen. cassette was used and on top of it the bass is too loud!

Agree on the packaging though!

[eelkiller]

Originally Posted by JeffMCarney

Have to disagree here except for _Tarkus_ and _Brain Salad Surgery_. BSS sounds remarkably similar in K2 form to the Castle issue (with the right mix). I think the _Tarkus_ K2 has goosed bass but it sounds pretty damn good. The _Trilogy_ K2 is, IMO, the worst of the lot. It is utterly stripped of so much treble that it sounds like a 5th gen. cassette was used and on top of it the bass is too loud!

Agree on the packaging though!

I must agree on the Trilogy K2. It does not sound good at all! The MFSL is much better IMO. The other K2's I have S/T, Tarkus, BSS sound pretty good.

[gd0]

Originally Posted by eelkiller

Trilogy K2. It does not sound good at all! The MFSL is much better IMO.

Hmmm... I had the exact opposite impression... one of those YMMV deals, I guess.

I will give you that the K2 Trilogy is kinda hissy on some tracks, though... esp Endless Enigma... but the title track, From the Beginning and Living Sin fare much better... again, IMO.

Well, even if the K2s are the discs of choice in my house, this catalog could still use one more trip through the mastering station... before the master tapes rot altogether.

Unless I'm missing something in those Rhino's, which I've ignored up to this point.

[Jeff Carney]

Originally Posted by JeffMCarney

If you are referring to the original Atalntic issue then I would differ on this, Jaime. I just picked this up over the weekend and while I agree with the general consensus around here that the Atlantic of the first (s/t) album is really nice, their issue of _Trilogy_ is terrible, IMO. Way, way too bright and yet the bottom end is too boomy also! If I didn't know better I'd think they got hold of a tape made with smiley-face EQ and then transferred it to digital! What their tape source was I have no idea but if my memory serves the Rhino and Castle (same mastering, iirc) blow this one completely out of the water. I'll A/B later tonight and confirm.

Did an A/B and I did overstate this, but the Castle CD is warmer and less harsh, no question about it to my ears. I believe I once compared the Rhino and Castle issues of _Trilogy_ and they were exactly the same, so I am presuming the Castle is the same mastering. The Castle has a very cool bonus track (live version of "Hoedown" that is fantastic!). Anyway, this sounds less harsh than the original Atlantic CD. I haven't heard the MFSL, but the Castle or Rhino are excellent, IMO.

[Runt]

Gotta go with the Japanese K2s...and of course, the cool mini-LP sleeves help! The first S/T sounds awesome, Tarkus is killer and Pictures At An Exhibition never sounded better IMHO. I've also got the hard-to-find Welcome Back and Works Vol. 1 K2s which sound incredible (well, let's face it...Welcome Back is never gonna sound that good!)

The only dog of the K2 bunch, as stated earlier, is the overly hissy Trilogy.

[eelkiller]

Originally Posted by Runt

I've also got the hard-to-find Welcome Back and Works Vol. 1 K2s which sound incredible (well, let's face it...Welcome Back is never gonna sound that good!)

I did not know there was a K2 of Works Volume 1. You do not see that one for sale on EBay (at least I have never seen it).

Originally Posted by gd0

I will give you that the K2 Trilogy is kinda hissy on some tracks, though... esp Endless Enigma... but the title track, From the Beginning and Living Sin fare much better... again, IMO.

I think it is the amount of hiss on some tracks that bothers me on Trilogy, I just found it overbearing on some of the tracks.

[Runt]

Originally Posted by eelkiller

I did not know there was a K2 of Works Volume 1. You do not see that one for sale on EBay (at least I have never seen it). I think it is the amount of hiss on some tracks that bothers me on Trilogy, I just found it overbearing on some of the tracks.

The K2 Works Vol. 1 occasionally shows up on Ebay and usually goes for big bucks. It was never reissued (same with Welcome Back) when the rest of the K2s were reissued recently.

[Jeff Carney]

Originally Posted by eelkiller

I think it is the amount of hiss on some tracks that bothers me on Trilogy, I just found it overbearing on some of the tracks.

Victor Japan has this problem on occasion. My suspicion is that their sometimes liberal use of EQ causes it but at least they don't use NR. Also, the K2 of the s/t sounds pretty darn hissy on stuff like "Take A Pebble" from what I recall.

[Jeff Carney]

Originally Posted by Runt

Gotta go with the Japanese K2s...and of course, the cool mini-LP sleeves help! The first S/T sounds awesome, Tarkus is killer and Pictures At An Exhibition never sounded better IMHO. I've also got the hard-to-find Welcome Back and Works Vol. 1 K2s which sound incredible (well, let's face it...Welcome Back is never gonna sound that good!)

The only dog of the K2 bunch, as stated earlier, is the overly hissy Trilogy.

I once bought the K2 of _Welcome Back..._ in jewelcase form (if you can even find it, the mini lp goes for *major* $$$ as it was issued in '98 or so and never reissued) and A/B'd it with (I think) the Castle release of the same. There was no difference at all. Strange since it has the 20-bit K2 mastering tag, but I'm not sure Victor Japan did anything with those tapes. In fact I think most versions of WBMF may be the same as I recall even checking the Victor or Castle against the original Atlantic (AMCY Japan) and it was also the same. I believe the Victory was different though, but can't say for sure. Anyway, I think WBMF sounds pretty good on CD but probably not as good as I remember the vinyl sounding!

[Skip Reynolds]

The BSS tracks on "The Atlantic Years" are my favorite mixes by far.

[ybe]

I have original Atlantic CDs of S/T and Trilogy mastered by Barry Diament and I like them a lot.

Originally Posted by 93curr

say, anybody else think that the 'Mass" segment from 'Tarkus' sounds just like the theme from 'NewsRadio'?

Yes! I mean ELP! They are very similar indeed.

[reidc]

I have the original Atlantics for all except BSS(I have Pictures,Tarkus, S/T, and Trilogy. I also have the original Welcome back from Japan with Obi(bought in early 90's).

As for the studio versions- I never really saw or heard a reason to replace them. As for BSS- I have one of the UK versions that opens in the middle, but is more of a Mini-LP release. I have nothing to compare it to, but it don't sound bad.

As for Welcome Back... in addition to the Japanese original- I also have either the Victory or the Rhino domestic as well. Its really been so long since I've done any listening to them I have no idea how they compare.

Chris

[Dave]

Originally Posted by ybe

I have original Atlantic CDs of S/T and Trilogy mastered by Barry Diament and I like them a lot.

Yes, me too. I also really my copy of Brain Salad Surgery. Thanks Michael!

The Atlantics mostly sound wonderful except for the Greatest Hits for some reason. Even the Japanese 1st pressing failed to impress because the original tracks sounded so much better on the original albums themselves.

[HeavyDistortion]

I also prefer the original Atlantic CDs for ELP's studio release up to, and including, "Brain Salad Surgery".



Ed Hurdle
HeavyDistortion

[John Buchanan]

Mundo has some of the Victor K2 mini-LPs available new on this page at cheap prices. You may want to email them to see if they're still there

http://www.mediawars.ne.jp/~mundo/collect/file/elp.html