"A Hard Days Night" DVD - really bad 5.1!

I really hated the 5.1 mix on the AHDN DVD. They didn't even bother to use all of the stereo mixes of the songs, and the rear channels were nothing but reverb!
Someone told me that there was a remix made of the movie songs that were never used except in the program, "YOU CAN"T DO THAT - the making of AHDN". Is that true?
Is it possible that a better 5.1 mix could be made even though the original dialouge/sound effects tapes could not be located?

 

Yeah we know it sucks...woulda been better off in the original mono, as nature intended...

 

I have the original DVD which is stereo and pretty darn good in my opinion, and I think the same as the Criterion LD. But the video print is not as good as on the horrible 5.1 version.

 

Quite simply, the reason for the fake 5.1 is because Miramax didn't have access to the Beatles EMI multi-tracks. AHDN is one of the projects that The Beatles themselves have no control over, so Apple wouldn't allow their use. Miramax was left with only the original mono film soundtracks to work with, and someone decided that we just wouldn't accept a DVD with mono sound, thus the phoney 5.1.

 

5.1 sucks, but stereo is pretty good

 

Anyone remember that Criterion AHDN that came on a (I think) QuickTime CD set? I thought I had one once, and will have to search for it.

Anyway, I wonder if THAT had the real songs in the original mono.

Anyone have this, or even remember it?

 

I don't have it anymore, but it had the stereo versions that were dubbed in for the MPI videocassette release. I don't recall if they were presented in true stereo, or folded down to mono, though.

 

The Criterion AHDN LD--like HELP!--has most of the songs dubbed in stereo, but other than that, there's no stereo that I remember--the rest of the soundtrack is mono, or if there is anything else directional going on, doesn't come to mind just now.

 

I remember it but don't have it. Never saw the point - if I wanted the movie from Criterion, I would've gotten the LD...

 

It's the wrong aspect ratio too, which bothered me even more than the lousy 5.1 mono. Tops of heads get cut off at times as well as words on signs etc. I've read a lot of reviews and forums about the DVD and am surprised more people didn't seem to notice this.

 

Keep in Mind that the Laserdisk and VHS STEREO mixes were remixes done by Ron Furmanek. These mixes ate the BEST mixes, hands down, of the Hard Days night music. They retain the punch of the mono while still being stereo.
I actually dubbed those mixes from the LD to CDR and THATS what I listen to.

Well worth picking up for Rons mixes.

 

.....Beatles collector, ya know?

 

The film is supposed to be letterboxed...the question is, was it matted correctly? Not sure....but in the theater, I can imagine the aspect ratio presented on the 5.1 DVD to be fairly close what's included here. The full screen image may offer more on the top and bottom, but you still lose a bit on the sides. Windowboxing the thing would have been the sensible way to go, but most companies won't do that, consumers generally don't understand and will bitch there's something 'wrong' with the transfer, when there isn't. Sigh....

It's not the only film like this: the STOP MAKING SENSE DVD has the exact same situation: top and bottom relative to the LD is cropped, sadly; a bit added to the sides of the picture compensates a little, but makes ya wish you could see the full camera frame....

 

Here are some screen captures I had made from both the MPI video from about 1997 and the DVD version. There isn't much gained on the sides at all. The top pics are the recent DVD and the bottom are the MPI VHS videotape. I didn't edit them at all.

 

Well, I'm going by the image I can reduce through my JVC player, which will windowbox any DVD...and there is information missing on the sides that can be recovered beyond what little you can see without having the 'reverse zoom' function.

Point is, with most home video setups, unless you've got just the right equipment, visually, you are likely to miss something beyond whatever matting was done for the DVD/VHS transfer.

The bigger question is, however, whether the full frame version of AHDN is the one that was intended for viewing, or whether, as with many films shot in full frame, for adapatation to TV and video media, you wind up seeing more than the director intended. In this instance--as with HELP! and STOP MAKING SENSE--IMO, the more you see the better, so, given how it was matted, kinda wish they had either not matted so severely, or not bothered at all.

However, AHDN is supposed to be matted mildly, as many british non-anamorphic films were in a general 1.66:1 aspect ratio back then(or thereabouts). Ken McAlinden could explain this further, I'm sure(among others)...

That said, I find the letterboxing less bothersome than the sound, which is just ridiculous.

 

I agree the sound is ridiculously awful and didn't intend to hijack the thread. (I can't see why any director would have intended that ratio however. The composition is so much better on the full frame shots of that film)

I just don't like chopped off heads in my DVDs (unless it's a slasher flick) .

 

Yes, hijacking is my business.....

 

I thought the story was actually more horrific than that. If I remember correctly, and someone here will correct me if I'm wrong , Ron Furmanek actually DID do a remix for the new release of A HARD DAY'S NIGHT in MONO. So it was DONE, a brand new remix for the film. THEN Mirimax decided to goose it with fake crud for 5.1 on DVD (and presumably in the theaters too). Now that's wacky, like I said, IIRC. I'm afraid, from here on out, that we'll always be baffled by the decisions made when it comes to Beatles stuff being re-released. Some faction is not gonna be happy.

 

The worst part of all is that the fake 5.1 mix is the only audio option. Some DVDs have up to seven different audio tracks to choose from ("Lord Of The Rings" extended editions for example), yet for "A Hard Day's Night" they only offer one? Not everyone has a surround set up, and who would want that mix anyhow? Why not offer a nice mono mix too? I wouldn't have minded a two-channel stereo sync-up like the MPI video too. Too much to ask for I guess.

 

Sum your amp to mono, The soundtrack improves by 90%.

 

I prefer the FULL FRAME...Thanks for the pics!...seeing is believing.

 

You're welcome. I had made the comparison screen captures about a year ago or so for the "Back To The Future" website, when they released the widescreen version of those movies with many scenes at the wrong aspect ratio. The studio ended up offering a trade in for the corrected versions. Some stores are still selling the improperly matted ones though.

 

When the BBC showed it some months back, it was in full frame and I'm pretty sure they may have used Ron's soundtrack. I say "might", because I haven't heard (has anyone) Ron's true mono version. The BBC sound had the mono mixes (with the George knocking the amp bit in "If I Fell") and sounded much clearer than the old VHS version I'd taped back in 1992.

Here's how they showed it...

Top DVD - bottom jolly old BBC

 

I think "many" is an overstatement. IIRC, there were a couple in "Part 2" and "Part 3" and that was it. I think it accounted for maybe two or three minutes of footage in all three flicks together.

Those screen caps of "Night" sure support 1.33:1 being the correct AR. I've never heard a definitive word, but the chopping at the top of the screen makes some of those shots look pretty bad...

 

Yup, the exchange was quite easy and went smooth!