Review of Black Sabbath 'Black Box'

Found this here:
http://www.black-sabbath.com/news.html

As far as sound quality, this is what the reviewer has to say:

I wasn't gonna buy this box, as I have 7 of the 8 albums on the Castle imports. I pre-ordered it anyway. CDUniverse has a good price on it (as well as the Monster Legacy DVDs) so I decided to get it.

 

I can't wait!

 

Reviewer said, "I cannot stress how great these discs sound. I've been listening to Black Sabbath since 1981."

He makes no mention of his experience with vinyl pressings, does he? I guess if CD is your favorite (media)format, this set might be the ticket.

 

I think the Rhino 2-disc set sounds mediocre at best, and VERY bad at worst. Presumably the Black Box is from the same mastering...

 

I liked the Rhino remastering. Perhaps we are just expecting too much from these tapes.

I find the Castle's to be too bright, the Warner's too Muddy.

 

Please elaborate!

 

I just think they're goosed a bit in the high and low end and sound more processed in most cases than either the Essentials or the original Warners discs. I don't think they went to england looking for tapes, either, but that's less important I guess. Tomorrows Dream on the Symptom set is the track that's absolutely ruined, IMO - screechy and nasty.

 

I basically love Black Sabbath's first 4 albums. Do I really want the others?
The price was too high for me. Even when I saw it USED at $50, I passed.

 

I've always thought that the Warner Bros. non-remastered CD's of S/T, Paranoid, Master Of Reality, Sabbath, Bloody Sabbath, and Tecnical Ecstacy all are mastered well. Dynamics-a-plenty. I haven't heard Mob Rules, Vol. 4, We Sold Our Souls For R & R, Seventh Star, The Eternal Idol, Headless Cross, TYR, Cross Purposes, Forbidden, Past Lives, or this box set, but the rest are all using NR and/or maximization.

 

Mine is pre-ordered from www.cduniverse.com . I have all the Castle remasters (even the one where the drop-out on the "Paranoid" album was fixed - although the reviewer of the box set doesn't mention that). I had all the Warner's issues, but sold them when I got the Castle remasters (won't be doing that again since I have learned my lessons well by hanging out on this forum). I also have all the Earmark vinyl that has recently been reissued and they, to my ears, sound pretty good. I also have the original Warner's vinyl (but some water damage still remains due to the infamous basement flood I have posted about in the past).

I love Black Sabbath - so regardless of what the discs in this set will sound like (and it does sound like the reviewer thinks they are good - but it seems to point to "louder is better" - which might mean over-compression) - I have to have it in my collection.

 

I'm taking a chance too since it is Rhino (and of course, Black Sabbath). Hopefully it'll be good enough I can unload all the Castles on eBay.

 

The reviewer is basically a professional Black Sabbath fan, not an audiophile or a recording engineer, so I'm sure he didn't do a comparison with vinyl. However, I think that he is familiar with the vinyl because, if he's been a fan since '81, that's all there was. Also, he had a contest where he gave away some 180 gram vinyl Sabbath LP's, so I'm sure he's heard them.

I think he's a good source for information on Sabbath, but he's probably not going to have the same level of analysis that most of you guys do. I'll be very interested to read some real audiophile reviews of this set.

I bought the Castle mini-LP set just last year. That's always the way - I buy one version, then a better versions pops up. I particularly like the Castle version of "Master of Reality."

I hope that the Black Box set turns up at BMG immediately, like "Symptom" did!

 

I remember when the symptom of the universe set came out, someone here (I think it was Claus) praised it has being better sounding than the castle re-masters, now someone slams the same set, so I'll let my ears be the judge as usual, when one person say something sucks and someone else praises it.

 

That's one I really like too, having never heard the Warners CD of it or any vinyl. Again, I'm expecting a market flood of old Warners Sab CDs after this box comes out so it'll be nice to get a few of those for comparison...

 

I've got a vinyl copy - original Warners green label. I got it back in the day, when I was about 15. I always though of MOR as a very "muddy" album, full of great songs but not a great recording. The Castle remaster changed my mind about it. Of course, it could be that my vinyl copy is just old and trashed. I plan to get the 180 gram vinyl LP someday soon. I've heard great thing about it.

 

I would guess that the Earmark uses the same digital source as the Castle CD.

 

Has anyone had a chance to play these yet and can offer a verdict? Mine's in town, but it's still in the UPS warehouse.

 

I played the first cd "Black Sabbath" and I was very impressed. The sound was very clean and distinct, with a slightly exaggerated high end. I wouldn't say it was bright, but the highs seemed "boosted" a bit from what I am used to hearing.

There was quite a bit of hiss (during the quieter sections), but it was not at all overpowering.

I seemed to detect some dynamic range compression, since at times the quieter parts sounder as loud or louder overall from when the band was in full swing. If compression was used it was used judiciously and was not overdone. For one thing, my ears tell me that the signal was not "maximized" - which is a good thing.

Without doing an out and out comparison between the Castle remaster and the Earmark vinyl (for which I have both), I have to believe that the newer Rhino/Warners CD equals or betters those issues.

(I used to have the original Warners CD - but traded it away when I got the Castle remasters. I still have the original Warners vinyl - but it is being stored in a location other than my home.)

 

Thanks for the review, Mike.

I've always thought the first album sounded the best, even back in the cassette days. I always thought it odd that the sound got dingier as the albums progressed.

 

I think if Claus gave it praise it must be a good job as he has great ears and feel very comfortable going with anything he recommends.

 

Black Sabbath Black Box Review

Honestly, The box set sounds better than every other release except for Technical Ecstasy, which the Castle remaster and original Vertigo pressing(CD) beat out the Black Box version by a mile. It seems for that title they might have used a 2nd or 3rd generation master tape copy for that title for some reason. Maybe someone has some insight about the master tape situation surrounding these albums, the 2 different labels releasing them, and where the original masters reside? Maybe there were more than one original master mixes made for some of the albums(US and UK)? Who would know?...Maybe Steve H???

 

I have all the Castles save for NSD and TE. Reading this thread, I am somewhat on the fence as to the box set. Guess its a deal where everyone needs to make their own choice.

On a related note, Red Trumpet has both NSD and TE on Castle for $8.99...my collection will soon be complete. I have both on vinyl, but for some reason never did the cee-dees.

BGL

 

I actually bought the box today. I thought Never Say Die sounded great. I'm just A/B'd Technical Ectasy Rhino vs Castle and they sound a little different but neither sounded worse than the other. I'm dumping the Castles as I'm don't doing dupes of titles anymore. I'm satisfied w/ what I've heard from the box so far.

I would like to know what tapes were used too.

 

I've made it up to and through Vol. 4 so far, and I'm liking what I hear. I haven't done any comparisons to the Castles yet, but I'm just carefully listening for anything that crosses my "suck" threshold -- nothing so far.

Like the reviewer linked at the top, I've been listening to Sabbath at least as long, but unlike him, I'm not hearing any drum fills I haven't heard before, or anything new for that matter (save for Ozzy releasing his tongue from the roof of his mouth between lines in "Changes", but that's more likely the better gear I've acquired since my last listen).

The treble seems to be boosted on these, but I personally don't hear the signs of compression or maximization evident on probably most newer rock CD releases. Viewing a waveform may tell you differently.

This box set gets the thumbs-up from me, the first remasters to do so since the Queensrÿches about a year ago.