Genesis SACD question

Forgive me if there is a thread for this already but I suck at the search function on here so if there's an existing thread that can answer this question, please post it if you dont want to take the time to answer directly.

I'm not interested in buying a whole Genesis boxset as I really only want three of their albums on SACD: Duke, Abacab, and Genesis. My question is, do these come as just SACD's or are some SACD/DVD's as I've seen elswhere? Also, are the DVD's DVD-Audio's? I'm confused because I could have sworn I saw a description somewhere that said that these albums came in a double SACD/DVD-A package. Not that I would complain as this sounds like a really cool way to compare the two high-rez formats if this in fact how some versions come. Finally, are these SACD's crazy expensive to get on their own? I have seen a 1976-1982 set available, but this one would leave off the Genesis (1983) album and I love that one.

Also, what is the consensus on here as to how these SACD's (DVD-A's?) sound?? Thanks!

 

they are not well liked by most here as they are remixes. i personally don't mind them but thats definitely an opinion in the minority.

 

Ugh...remixes?! Well, how bad have they been fiddled with? I dont mind a little change but not if it changes the whole flow of the song/album.

 

Well, if these SACD's are not the best available, which versions of Duke, Abacab and Genesis are considered the best sounding for each album? I'd like to make the effort to get them each if possible.

 

2 Disks: Hybrid SA-CD + DVD (audio + visual)
Stereo/Multichannel

Duke cat# 3851812 (PAL), 3859702 (NTSC) http://www.sa-cd.net/showtitle/4381
Abacab cat# 3851832 (PAL), 3859662 (NTSC) http://www.sa-cd.net/showtitle/4380
Genesis cat# 5038272 (PAL), 5038292 (NTSC) http://www.sa-cd.net/showtitle/4706

Prices are reasonable except perhaps for ABACAB.

 

So it IS a DVD-A...wow. Is there any other example of a SACD/DVD-Audio release of the same album in the same package? Thanks tribby...

 

Yes, they are remixes, largely for the sake of 5.1. But they are not radically altered from the originals, and do offer a clearer presentation of instumentation and vocals. However, there is a degree of compression added, more distinct on Duke and Abacab, from the first series than on Genesis from the second box set. Many feel that this significantly degrades the potential sound quality. Speaking for myself, I like 'em, but it's certainly comes down to personal preference.

I am not familiar with any SACD only version of these releases. Furthermore, there is no such release that includes a DVD-A. It is only DVD with a Dolby Digital 5.1 and 96kHz/24bit DTS version of the albums plus bonus interview and video extras.

 

Ah, Ok, that makes more sense to me. Thanks Henry! I'm not as bothered by compression as much as some are on here, though if there are better sounding versions of the three albums I want out there, than I'd be interested to know what they are.

 

Do you have the 1994 remaster versions of these titles? I would say that these are the best in terms of sound quality of the original mixes. In comparison to the SACD versions, I think a lot of it comes down to individual tastes.

 

The only one of the three I have is Genesis and I'm not sure what year that one came out as there's no year other than 1983 on it (though it definately isnt an original release).

 

I thought the early albums benefitted from a lot more clarity with the remixes, but I've only heard the vinyl box set.

 

Genesis was never remastered prior to these recent releases, so technically it is an original version. I would recommend getting the SACD release of that one.

 

I was wondering the same thing about these releases - so thanks for the question and answers!

 

I have to disagree with the assertion that some of these remixes aren't radical - especially on Duke. I think Davis destroyed the character of the record, and compression is the least of it. Abacab to a lesser extent, but he did a number on Another Record. If you know the original records, and love them, tread very cautiously. I'm speaking strictly of the stereo remixes.
And feel free to check my post history...I am not prone to hyperbolic terms like "unlistenable" and "brick walled". Duke, in it's remixed form is a sonic atrocity.

 

If you're really sensitive to compression, avoid the remixes. But from a purely musical standpoint, I enjoy them quite a bit...they're much clearer, and offer a better picture (IMO) of what each band member was doing on the recording. Maybe not for purists, but I think they're worth listening to if you can get past the compression.

 

Uhmm...(clearing throat..)
they are NOT DVD-As, they are DVD-Video with Dulby and DTS 96/24 (much better!) mixes.
IMO, the 76-82 are TOO bright sounding,
AND (caveat emptor)
the "gated" drum sound on all of Abacab was NOT emulated, so it is a revisionist mix.
Mind you , I like them too, but it's a different animal.
I have the PG box(not bright and the best of the bunch), the 76-82 (very good bit too bright..and revisionist) and the LIVE one (a bit of a ripoff- only 3 5.1 sets...and Steve Hackett is "underhandedly" mixed down in Seconds Out, especially "Firth of Fifth")

 

Of those SACD/DVD titles I only have Wind and Wuthering and if that's an indication of what the others are like I wouldn't touch them with a barge pole. Way, way too bright for me and a terrible waste of the SACD formats potential.

 

Yes, they suck. (I hope that was the question.)

Seriously, I bought the 1976-1982 box on SACD and stopped there. The mastering is crap (loud, harsh). Given the cost of these SACD boxes, plus the need for me to find them with NTSC DVDs, I gave up after the first one. I bought a couple of the other Genesis boxes as Rhino CDs and wasn't impressed with them either. Further reason not get them on SACD, as I figure they would have the same mastering as the Rhino CDs.

 

I approach listening to music from an enjoyment point of view.
I bought all of the Japanese SACD OBI versions of these albums a couple of years ago on CDJapan. These have the same mastering as the European PAL versions.
They so do not suck.
Before I bought these, I had a couple of 70s Genesis Vinyls and the rest were 80's CDs. listening to the multichannel layer of the SACDs was a breadth of fresh air compared to listening to the Vinyl and CDs.

 

No, no no. The 1994 remasters are not good. Duke is no-noised. Horrible. The original Atlantic or V/C discs are way better.

pmckeeaalaska, for Genesis the original V/C's form UK/Europe in the 80's are the best on cd. They are much better than the hyper-compressed SACD's or the noise-reduced DE remasters.

 

I agree that the Duke remix is pretty screwed. They applied too much hi pass filtering
on some of the individual instrument tracks and the album has lost much of that warm
body I was always used to hearing and loved.

I do like some of the remixes though. The Gabriel era and the live sets were done much
better than the '76-'82 and '83-'97 sets were. Some other remixes would probably be
shine better if they didn't destroy them in mastering.

I agree with Yestiles. Unless you are after the 5.1 mixes stick with the early cds released
in the mid-late 80's. The Barry Diament mastered Duke blows away the new version.

 

The 1994 remasters are "ok".

I have mine and will sell them if someone wanted them. The 1980's V/C and Atlantic discs are the way to go.

 

I only have the Peter Gabriel box. It's kind of fun to listen to once and the video content is nice. But the stereo remixes are earbleeders and it was with that box set that I finally came to the realization that 5.1 surround for music isn't really my thing.

There have been some nice CD versions of the Genesis catalog, but I prefer vinyl for these guys.

 

I agree. The live box especially is very good.

5.1. surround for music is my thing i suppose, but the ear-piercing EQ ruins these surround mixes for me.

 

These are available individually - prices vary. I have about eight of the new Genesis combos, four on UK import SACD/DVD, four on regular US CD/DVD.

The DVD for the SACD sets are intended for the UK market, and have region coding and PAL formatting. You won't be able to play the DVD unless your DVD player can do UK region and PAL conversion. The 5.1 remixes have a nice novelty to them and are a cool new way to listen to the albums IMO. From what I've heard, I think the DTS DVD 5.1 mixes sound just as good as the SACD version.

I don't like the new stereo mixes on most of the albums. The mixes sound very "modern". Every instrument is extremely distinct, and the vocals are up-front. They sound nothing like the originals for the most part. In the case of "Wind & Wuthering", it's a good thing since the original W&W sounded like mud IMO. In most other cases I prefer the original vinyl or older CD.

The video content on the DVDs is very compelling - I love it.