Ghost image of songs before playback on vinyl

I have noticed on some LP's that before a song starts, I can hear a very light preview of the track. Is this a tracking problem?

 

If this is a record made from a magnetic tape recording (i.e., pre-digital recording), you are probably listening to "print-through" which is caused by the information on one layer of the tape leaking into another layer of tape over time.

 

I seem to remember this with certain cassette tapes of mine, too (with the volume cranked, or via headphones). What is it - relevant to the master tape/mastering, and likely analog? If someone in these parts could explain, I'm curious to know.

I highly doubt it's a tracking problem.

 

I recently experienced this with a cd for the first time ever

 

OR... it's 'pre-echo' caused by the silent groove of the record having a slight impression from the adjacent groove. I think this phenomena only applied to records; I've never heard a CD exhibit this.

 

I hear it on a number of lps in the collection - including new releases. I'll buy the magnetic tape explanation except for the new releases where we all know that the source is digital.

In any case, I find it charming and make no effort to remove it from my needledrops.

 

yeah I did not think it was something I would ever hear on cd very strange

 

Weird! Now I have to wonder if the cassettes I played a thousand times have their own "print-through", or if it was off the master tape to begin with?

 

Yes. Pre-digital recordings. UK and US pressings of Deep Purple In Rock. Have also noticed it on some other Lp's(Analog) I just put on the Led Zep Mothership (Digital) box with no ghost imaging. Also tried MFSL Abbey Road. NO ghost image found on that.

 

It does not really bother me as long as It is not some type of tracking issue.

 

The most noticable example of this I have on CD is the Pet Shop Boys' Behaviour (I have the 2001 remaster). Most audibly immediately before 'This Must Be the Place I Waited Years to Leave' and 'How Can You Expect to Be Taken Seriously?'

 

I think most of the time on vinyl this phenomenon is groove echo, not print-through on the master tape. An easy way to tell that is if the sound corresponds to exactly one revolution before the music starts, then it's groove echo.

 

lots of dance records do this.

 

this effect was used to queue up songs to play when I worked in radio. You'd manually turn the record with the needle in place until you could begin to hear this effect in your headphones. Then when you were ready you'd activate the appropriate turntable and swing the gain arm over to the correct side...you could have a gap-delay or an overlapping segue depending on your style.

 

Egg-zackly!

 

Wow, some zany stuff here. The 'echo' is most commonly due to the preview signal during the cutting stage. It can be from tape print through but that's less common. there was a long thread about this phenomena a while back....

 

Someone more knowledgeable than me can chime in, but I really don't think that well-functioning cutting equipment will let the preview head's signal through to the cutting head. The preview head is fed to the cutting system so it can adjust groove pitch and depth due to changes in dynamics, and the actual playback tape head is fed to the cutter head itself. Why should you be getting signal from the preview head to the cutter head?

 

I believe one of the benefits of Direct Metal Mastering is it eliminates the groove print-through and echo sounds.

 

Zep I & II have this everywhere! III also has some !

 

I always heard it on US copies of Sabbaths Paranoid album (War Pigs specifically - that bit where the hi hat is just swishing before the power chords). It wasn't on the UK copies.

 

Most likely what you're hearing is groove echo. I came across this detailed explanation from mastering supremo Bob Ludwig just last week and there are more factors at play than just the cutting of the lacquer.

 

A very timely thread, as I've heard this phenomenon on several records and was wondering about it. I had assumed it meant the pressing was defective in some way. But the technical explanation from Ludwig above implies that every pressing from a given lacquer will have the problem. In other words, if I am unhappy with the groove echo on a given record I would need to find a copy with different matrices to have any hope of obtaining a copy without groove echo? Bummer

 

We need to compile the many comments on LP pre-echo that have been made on here in one form or another by Steve, Kevin Gray, Bob Ludwig, Stan Ricker, etc. and put them in a FAQ. This question seems to come up fairly often.

 

When I was at the mastering session yesterday Steve explained that this is the reason the mastering studio is at RTI so that when the laquer is cut it can immediately be taken over to start the vinyl creation process. The laquer is alive and slowly starts to melt out of the cut shape. Maybe Steve will chime in an improve my poor articulation.

 

Groove echo

Tape print through if its a copy with no leader tape

Or both