Bowie's "Ziggy" CD (RCA Japan VS. RCA West Germany)

Has anyone compared the two? I was told that some of the RCA discs are inferior to the others.

 

If you haven't already...
http://needledrop.wikispaces.com/David+Bowie+CD+Comparisons

So far, there's only one RCA sample - the Japan - and it's been mentioned by some Forum members that it is generally preferable over the German.
But I've not compared myself. I have the Japan RCA cd. It's good
The vinyl blows it away, though.

 

Thanks for the link! Of course, there are no "Ziggy" comparisons...hahaha. Why do others prefer the Japanese to the German?

 

I was just told that the difference between the two is that the Japanese disc is a teeny-bit louder. How much of an effect does this have on the listening experience? More hiss if the sound is lower?

 

Well, that's hardly a surprise.

 

The Japan for US RCA disc sounds fantastic! I was shocked at how good it sounded.

 

I've actually got a German Ziggy and am already registered over there. I'll put the sample up later tonight.

Geoff

 

That would be awesome! Please provide a link when you do.

 

Just head over to the Wikispaces page and it should be up now.

Geoff

 

Nice! Thanks. I believe the German is slightly better than the Japanese disc. Any thoughts?

 

This subject kind of hurts my head. I'm fairly sure that there have been EAC logs showing a difference in masters from different countries (though they're often just a consistent difference in volume). What exactly is changed, why, and how noticeable it can be... I dunno. I haven't really performed any comparisons on that level. But hey, the more headaches it can create for us, the better, right?

Sometimes I wish I never learned the meanings of words like "loudness war", "Targets", etc. etc. There truly is happiness in ignorance sometimes!

(By the way, thanks for pulling up that link to the Wiki of comparisons. I've been meaning to head over there and confirm this for myself!)

 

Just a wild guess here, but it's not impossible that it's down to the European masters being transferred from tapes closer to the original masters. The Japan-for-US blue label discs were possibly mastered either from tapes held in storage in the States (or in Japan?). RCA UK would have held the master tapes in their vaults, no?

 

It shouldn't be that painful - think of it as a new hobby

The differences in mastering among early CD's weren't really intentional - they just happened because different tapes were available or sent to different parts of the world for transfer to CD. Because these were often dubs of the original master tape, there were of course variations in the quality of them, and therefore variations in the end result on the CD's. Also different mastering engineers would use different techniques. Just listen to the smooth analog feel of an early Barry Diament CD - he eschewed the use of the early digital mastering consoles because he felt they hurt the sound too much. Sometimes the mastering differences between CD's from different countries are subtle, sometimes blatant.

 

Owing to a happy fluke on amazon marketplace, I own both these RCA Ziggys!

As has been noted in earlier threads, they have different EAC peak values but IMHO they sound very similar - more like a difference in EQ than source tape.

I prefer the German disc because it sounds closer to the vinyl LP I grew up with. (This holds true of many of the RCA Bowies, which were presumably prepped from LP masters.) I would be fascinated to know if the Japan for US is a close match for LP pressings from elsewhere eg. Japan or America (funnily enough).

 

Thanks for posting the WG version, Geoff.

The two (WG and Japan) sound very similar to me.

 

Yes, both are great. I like the German version more for some strange reason. Maybe it sounds closer to the vinyl?

 

If it's a completely different digital transfer from a different tape, that changes everything. I love the German RCA. Haven't heard the Japan issue. Maybe someone could post the EAC's for it.

 

EAC extraction logfile from 17. July 2008, 9:38 for CD
David Bowie / The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars

Used drive : MATSHITAUJDA755yDVD/CDRW Adapter: 1 ID: 0
Read mode : Secure with NO C2, accurate stream, disable cache
Combined read/write offset correction : 0
Overread into Lead-In and Lead-Out : No

Used output format : C:\Program Files\Exact Audio Copy\LAME\lame.exe (User Defined Encoder)
192 kBit/s
Additional command line options : %l--preset 128%l%h--preset standard%h %s %d
Use compression offset : 2257

Other options :
Fill up missing offset samples with silence : Yes
Delete leading and trailing silent blocks : No
Installed external ASPI interface


Track 1
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 01 - Five Years.wav

Peak level 84.3 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC 65AAD3DD
Copy OK

Track 2
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 02 - Soul Love.wav

Peak level 88.9 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC DD169BD5
Copy OK

Track 3
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 03 - Moonage Daydream.wav

Peak level 94.2 %
Track quality 99.9 %
Test CRC BFC1234C
Copy OK

Track 4
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 04 - Starman.wav

Peak level 89.9 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC 161A09B8
Copy OK

Track 5
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 05 - It Ain't Easy.wav

Peak level 87.5 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC EC17E8BA
Copy OK

Track 6
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 06 - Lady Stardust.wav

Peak level 74.6 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC 9C4EA490
Copy OK

Track 7
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 07 - Star.wav

Peak level 89.7 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC B9F1ABAF
Copy OK

Track 8
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 08 - Hang on to Yourself.wav

Peak level 82.3 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC A8E731B0
Copy OK

Track 9
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 09 - Ziggy Stardust.wav

Peak level 74.8 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC 27142910
Copy OK

Track 10
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 10 - Suffragette City.wav

Peak level 87.5 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC D30F7BB0
Copy OK

Track 11
Filename E:\Ripped\David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars - 11 - Rock 'n' Roll Suicide.wav

Peak level 82.9 %
Track quality 100.0 %
Test CRC AD333303
Copy OK

No errors occured


End of status report

 

Is that Japan or WG?

 

Japan.

 

Good points, thanks for clearing that up. You just have to wonder though... wouldn't it have been easier and cheaper to just use one darn master everywhere, from the same source? I guess it was a different era though... and perhaps they were learning on their feet, so to speak. Plus it couldn't have been any easier back then to coordinate your efforts. And then there's the issue of who has what rights to what, I suppose...

Head still hurtin' a bit! Sometimes I wish I took the blue pill...

 

Amen to THAT, brother! I'm new to the forum, and it becomes STAGGERING....

 

Shucks! I just paid a hefty sum for these discs using Buy it Now and NOW this seller puts them up for bid


RCA Germany "Ziggy Stardust" CD:


http://cgi.ebay.com/David-Bowie-Zig...hash=item280247637755&_trksid=p3911.m14.l1318


RCA Germany "Low" CD:

http://cgi.ebay.com/David-Bowie-Low...hash=item280247404209&_trksid=p3286.m14.l1318

 

I'd read in a Bowie thread that the German was glaring and too bright, and that the Japan was almost unanimously preferred.
Interesting.

 

I keep reading different things about the WG and Japan RCAs. I think far fewer people own (or have owned) both than actually opine on the subject.