Has M&K kicked the bucket?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by soundboy, Feb 23, 2007.

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  1. soundboy

    soundboy Senior Member Thread Starter

    On its website, it mentioned the closing of its CA factory as of 02/22/2007. However, it says nothing about the company going out of business.

    Anyone knows for sure?
     
  2. -=Rudy=-

    -=Rudy=- ♪♫♪♫♫♪♪♫♪♪ Staff

    Location:
    US
    No clue, but I hate to see another company start "offshoring" manufacturing jobs... :shake:
     
  3. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    That is strange. I own two M&K subs, both are really nice although maybe not the best bang for the buck out there.

    M&K has a long history and strong professional presence, I'd be suprised if they closed up shop.
     
  4. soundboy

    soundboy Senior Member Thread Starter

    I actually think they're doing that already. I've seen photos of M&K's new showroom in China and the products they specifically make for that market. I will link those pics once I find them on the net.
     
  5. coopmv

    coopmv Newton 1/30/2001 - 8/31/2011

    Location:
    CT, USA
    I hear you. I thought M&K used to make pretty good subs.
     
  6. soundboy

    soundboy Senior Member Thread Starter

    I just came across the following response by M&K's Ken Kreisel which kind of explain why M&K has went out of business....

    Creek also went through a similar situation several years ago when its OEM in China "hijacked" its product. Of course, Creek survived and it's still amongst us.
     
  7. coopmv

    coopmv Newton 1/30/2001 - 8/31/2011

    Location:
    CT, USA
    This is a very sad story. Counterfeited goods are major problems for many European, American and Japanese manufacturers. Some countries just completely ignore the bylaws of the WTO.
     
  8. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    Soundboy, thanks for sharing. So they are definitely out of business? Their website still seems unclear :confused:
     
  9. Danny

    Danny Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    I just got to say that the wording of that letter seems kind of strange. I don't know anything about Mr. Kreisel or M&K so I don't really know what kind of connection I'm trying to make. But just reading it over, I was thinking how unusual some of the wording was.
     
  10. coopmv

    coopmv Newton 1/30/2001 - 8/31/2011

    Location:
    CT, USA
    The M&K sad experience should make many small American companies that have excellent product quality think twice before they outsource to some unscrupulous offshore manufacturers.
     
  11. fyrfytrhoges

    fyrfytrhoges New Member

    Location:
    wisconsin
    i have one question relating to m&k speakers and pioneer etc. etc. receivers, dvd players and so on, isnt the THX certification been deemed bogus? this is only what ive read, i can say that my pioneer elite THX receiver sounds like doo doo......
     
  12. coopmv

    coopmv Newton 1/30/2001 - 8/31/2011

    Location:
    CT, USA
    I believe any amps that have the THX logo need to pay George Lucas & Company royalties.
     
  13. SamS

    SamS Forum Legend

    Location:
    Texas
    I'm sure they thought long and hard about the decision. All last year, I worked for a company (different industry) that started to offshore some of their product to China. It was done purely to save on costs and to be competitive. No American business owner wants to cut domestic jobs so they can start bringing in a container load of stuff from overseas. It's just how the market works. If you want to stay viable in an extremely competitive market, and you're really getting hammered on price, offshore manufacturing is something you will have to consider one day.

    To 'earn' or license a product for THX status, you have to meet rigorous standards for measured response, user interface, algorithms and a host of other requirements. That doesn't always transfer into good sound, it's more like a stamp of approval that the product has met pre-determined required specs.
     
  14. seriousfun

    seriousfun Forum Resident

    M&K's troubles run longer and deeper than just the Chinese counterfeiting issue. It probably was the last straw...but not the total story by any means.

    Quality, controlled Chinese manufacturing should have been done years ago, but M&K apparently ran into this significant problem.They're not the only company to be hit like this - there is still little respect of intellectual property there.

    SamS gave a reasonable explaination about THX. Not all M&K speakers were THX, but M&K's designs were a major part of the THX formula.

    I believe that it is clear that M&K is gone for good.
     
  15. coopmv

    coopmv Newton 1/30/2001 - 8/31/2011

    Location:
    CT, USA
    I wonder how Quad and KEF are doing these days quality wise? Both formerly British companies were bought out by the Chinese two or three years ago.
     
  16. Blair G.

    Blair G. Senior Member

    Location:
    Delta, BC, Canada
    I don't know about Quad but after years of being almost invisible KEF is suddenly all over the place. At least it looks that way.

    Biggest chain around these parts now carries them as well as at least one of the HiFi shops. I see a lot more advertising and reviews the last couple of years.

    Not sure about the quality though. The lower models look kind of cheap and light weight. I'm glad I bought all of my KEF speakers while they were still built in Britain.
     
  17. coopmv

    coopmv Newton 1/30/2001 - 8/31/2011

    Location:
    CT, USA
    I have never owned British speakers, but I love my Canadian speakers. The PSB's and Axioms are every bit as good as most British speakers except the top of the line B&W's. They are also much more affordable due to the still favorable exchange rate and I prefer to support North American-made products, including my Honda Pilot which was built in Ontario. If I buy anything British-made, it has to be both designed and built in Britain, like my Rega Planet 2000 and NAD 118.
     
  18. Blair G.

    Blair G. Senior Member

    Location:
    Delta, BC, Canada
    I agree about the exchange rate thing and most of the Canadian speakers are an even better deal for us up here.

    Luckily I bought my main KEFs just before the exchange rate was an issue (I paid $1700, a year later they were $3K).
    My theatre KEFS were bought from a small dealer who sells to me at close to cost. Otherwise I'd have bought Cdn for sure.

    Planet 2000....nice machine.
     
  19. coopmv

    coopmv Newton 1/30/2001 - 8/31/2011

    Location:
    CT, USA
    I absolutely will not pay over $2K for a pair of British speakers that were not made in Britain, period. Relative to the pound, the USD has gone to hell.
     
  20. Blair G.

    Blair G. Senior Member

    Location:
    Delta, BC, Canada
    Neither would I.

    Probably should have pointed out my 104.2's are from '86, long before offshore manufacturing was an option. And at that time the exchange rate pounds -> Canadian $$ was favorable. Not now.

    I think the current KEF Reference line is still made in Britain but I still wouldn't touch them.

    All the British speakers I like now are still designed and built in England: Spendor, Harbeth and a few others.
     
  21. coopmv

    coopmv Newton 1/30/2001 - 8/31/2011

    Location:
    CT, USA
    I just located a Spendor dealer in CT. When I get my Mac at some point, I would like it to drive a pair of Spendors. Indeed, country of manufacuring is important to me. I just do not care for designed in country X and assembled in country Y and the product is marketed as a product from country X, particularly when the product costs a non-trivial amount of money.
     
  22. Rolf Erickson

    Rolf Erickson New Member

    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    I agree with the tenor of this thread.

    My experience is that Chinese (Communist) made parts and products are generally inferior, often to an apalling degree, to Ameri-Euro made products. On top of that, they are often Crooks in regard to property rights as well. I enjoyed the sound of M&K products in the 1970's when I first heard them in Santa Monica, CA. At Miller sound. (The "M" in M&K) They were early adopters of the "Satellite/Sub-Woofer" concept. It saddens me when I hear of an American company being made to go out of business by Chinese criminal operators.
     
  23. Mike from NYC

    Mike from NYC Senior Member

    Location:
    Surprise, AZ
    'Quality control' and 'Chinese made' are oxymorons. Many companies who 'off-shored' their factory production and or software production are finding lots of problems they didn't anticipate and they are finding that their cost savings are being eaten up by the high rate of rejected items and the attendant shipping costs. This is not only a M&K problem but a problem being experienced by almost all manufacturers who now source components from China and India.

    Even the simplest of items such as 'train wheels' have a high reject ratio as many were machined off-center and had to be returned or put on a lathe to 'true-up' the wheel done at great expense at the railroad yards. The LIRR has experienced numerous problems.

    While Chinese products are getting better, the zealous cost cutting frenzy of corporations are squeezing factory prices and the owners of the plants forego quality control and/or use inferior components than originally intended to make up the difference.

    Theft of patents, trademarks and software is another HUGE problem in China and India and the problem is out-of-control. Companies usually find out about this too late before their profits are killed off.

    While I don't want to appear as a racist I don't trust the Chinese manufacturing industry as I think it is embedded with thieves. Piracy is rampant and the government is making veiled attempts to stop it but have not even dented the problem nor do they want to. Why any company would move its manufacturing to China is beyond me and companies need to research the problems of others before they make the leap to China.
     
  24. soundboy

    soundboy Senior Member Thread Starter

    Corruption is a series problem there and government officials often look the other way if they're paid "under the table". In fact, theft of intellectual properties is often done by government officials (i.e. CD piracy).
     
  25. seriousfun

    seriousfun Forum Resident

    Your argument may have been relevant ten years ago. I am in the manufacturing business; we have researched Chinese manufacturing and, while it is not right for our products now (we work on a small scale and build high-quality products), we may do this in the future. Many other companies in our industry are successfully doing this - they have to be careful. I'd hardly call this a problem for all manufacturers, since so much of what we buy isn't available except if it's made in China.

    I worked for M&K for seven years, at their peak. I won't say anything good or bad about them, but Chinese counterfeiting was probably not their biggest problem or the main reason for the closure.
     
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