Miles Davis - Birth of the Cool...there's no good version on CD!

I was thinking the same thing. It gets me kind of angry that the powers that be are ruining the Rudy Van Gelder legacy by pasting his name all over these second rate re-masters, and lying to the public in such an obvious way.

 

What makes you say that? Can you provide any proof for your allegations?

By the way, there is only one RVG remaster of The Birth of the Cool.

 

Hans,

I don't have proof, only suspicion. We will never know for sure as Rudy Van Gelder is really opaque about his mastering and re-mastering methods. There is an expression, Res Ipsa Loquitor, the thing speaks for itself. Rudy has not done himself proud with his RVG remasters, turning some real classics into sonic turds. Had his previous remasters actually improved upon the previous releases, I might be more inclined to believe claims of newly discovered master tapes.

The major record companies have lied to us before. Remember the old Columbia "Digitally remastered from the original master tapes" series. It turned out that they were not. Ironically, the best quality cd often turns out to be the humble, regular reissue like the McMaster Blue Notes or the Tarantino mastered OJCs.

The year - Birth of the Cool sessions were not one, but three sessions done in 1949 and 1950. They were released as 78s, only released in lp form years later. Nothing I have heard from before 1950 sounds very good, whereas, there are lots of really good sounding recordings from 1953 and 1954. Even if this were one of the really early tape sessions, I am suspicious that the three master tapes would have been lost for 60 years, and that they miraculously found all three master tapes.

I know it may be bad form to comment on the work of another professional, but maybe the professionals on this board like Barry or Steve could comment on this?

 

Wow, thanks for this info. Great insight into a wonderful "compilation."

 

I assumed it was a well-known fact that this was originally not an album and that these sessions were recorded on various dates for 78s. I guess I was wrong.

 

My Miles Davis discography just states "Studio, New York City". The master tapes or matrix number for each track are of this format:
3395-3E
3396-3D
3765
etc.
Not sure if someone can tell by these numbers if this refers to tape or to matrix numbers.

 

The recording details are as follows - sorry, no studio info:

NYC, January 21, 1949
3395-3 Jeru
3396-3 Move
3397-2 Godchild
3398-1 Budo (i.e. Hallucinations)

NYC, April 22, 1949
3764 Venus de Milo
3765 Rouge
3766-2 Boplicity
3767-2 Israel

NYC, March 9 (some discographies say March 13), 1950
4346 Deception
4347 Rocker
4348 Moon Dreams
4349 Darn That Dream (vocal)

 

I do now have the studio info:

Capitol Recording Studio, NYC, January 21, 1949
3395-3 Jeru
3396-3 Move
3397-2 Godchild
3398-1 Budo (i.e. Hallucinations)

Capitol Recording Studio, NYC, April 22, 1949
3764 Venus de Milo
3765 Rouge
3766-2 Boplicity
3767-2 Israel

Capitol Recording Studio, NYC, March 9, 1950
4346 Deception
4347 Rocker
4348 Moon Dreams
4349 Darn That Dream (Kenny Hagood, vocal)

 

Here are the peak levels from my CD version. I would be interested in the levels for the other CD's to see whether there are actually different masterings available (before the RVG remaster).

I also included a picture of the wav-form of the track "Israel" which has a 100% peak level but there is no digital compression applied.

 

Not to threadcrap, but can anyone tell me how this '60s or '70s LP version sounds? Is it reprocessed or anything?

 

It definitely sounds like the original tapes were used on the RVG issue. The music sounds, hmmm, let me see how I can phrase it...more present. Obviously there is peak limiting, EQ and bad imaging helping the CD sound more "modern" but you can tell that the tapes are better than what was previously used on the PREMASTER and the COMPLETE version.

 

It starts on the note with the cymbal crash - I think it's an E flat.

 

Yeah, yours is cut off, there should be a Bb before the Eb.

 

Much thanks for the info here...I wanted to pick up this cd, but did not know which version to buy!

 

And now...you still don't...haha.

 

I agree, there is no CD version that sounds good. I've just listened to my Japanese CD from 1995 and its sound is muddy, veiled. I preferred it to the RVG, though; I compared them when I still had that one.

 

Classic LP

Jason, not to crap on your thread about CD's, but have you heard the Classic Records LP version, mastered by Bernie Grundman? I bought a used copy recently at Amoeba and it sounds great, a little bright as is Bernie's wont, but excellent. Sounds 'present' like the RVG but without the useless tinkering imaging compression yadda. It was the first time I'd heard the recordings sound good. That RVG is stinker and the Complete left me wanting.

EDIT: Just read post #9

 

Here's an updated table:

 

Thanks guys. It's very good to know what the real deal is. My RVG CD now goes into the sell pile....

 

Well, as I indicated earlier I still don't know what the real (CD) deal is and this thread has made me none the wiser (no offence to the thread starter)

 

I think a listening party is due Eddie.

 

Here's Israel from the PRE:

 

Roland,

Just to update for everyone else, on the PREMASTER, "Darn That Dream" has a peak level of 91.9...

 

The Cello insignia on the back of your cd refers to the high-end company of the same name that Mark Levinson started after "leaving" Madrigal. When I worked for him, he was big into getting studios to use Cello products in the mastering process and getting the company's name on the finished product (free advertising). For a while, the jazz label DMP used Cello products in the recording studio.

When Complete was remastered, they probably used the Audio Palette, which was a gorgeous equalizer that went for around $10,000-$12,000 when I was with the company. Here's a link with some info on the Palette:

http://www.celloseattle.com/ctdocs/prodserve/peripherals/audiopalette.html

Here's a quote from this link:http://chaos.com/product/complete_birth_of_the_cool_10678_4461.html