Are there any 5.1 signal switchers?

[GoldenBoy]

I recently decided to finally purchase a DVD player. I had been holding out because I was never much of a movie and/or Home Theatre buff, but I purchased the new Cowboy Junkies 2-disc set, Open Road, which comes with 1 CD and one DVD. The DVD is packed with live performances which I can't watch. If that wasn't enough, I received a DVD copy of the latest Sports Illustrated swimsuit video. So it is time. I decided then to see if there were any inexpensive DVD players that also handle DVD-A. Even though I am firmly committed to SACD and was in no way looking to match the quality of my SACD player, I figured If I'm going to buy a new player, why not. I found a JVC model that handles all the usual suspects as well as DVD-A for $199! Well, I had to jump at that opportunity. But as you all know, neither DVD-A nor SACD have digital outs for their Hi-Rez, so I'm stuck using the 5.1 analog outs, but , of course, I only have the one 5.1 receiver/amp and my SACD player is already attached, so what to do for the DVD-A discs? I would really rather not have to unplug and plug and unplug and so on just to switch between the two formats. :shake: Is there anything I can do? are there any signal switcher type things that would allow me to attach both units and then just switch between which ones signal gets sent out to the receiver?

Thanks in advance for any help.

[Sckott]

SACD woulnd't let you go out through coax or optical anyways, no matter how you try. Sony made it a point for all SACD stereo and 5.1 to go out to preamp/receivers in an analogue RCA connection only. The DAC is onboard, and will not be sent any other way. They mentioned that might change in the future, but for now, that's the reason you won't get opitcal for SACD. Part of it is a copy-protection scheme idea, the rest, well, simplification.

My SACD player will go out optically, but not when an SACD is playing.


The rest means you may have to get a new reciever or preamp to facilitate the "switching" you want to do. My Rotel 965 lets this happen. You need one that takes coax, optical and RCA as well as 5.1 analogue. Most units in homes just can't cut that.

[GoldenBoy]

I think you may have partially misunderstood my original post. I realize, as I noted, that neither SACD nor DVD-A will allow digital output of their Hi-Rez signals. What I was asking was is there any sort of switcher, outside of an A/V amp that will take more than one 5.1 analog input, that would allow me to attach both players and then act as a pass-through to the A/V receiver that would allow me to switch between the 2 signals. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear about this in my first post. :)

[GoldenBoy]

Oh, and 1 other thing, my A/V amp does have all of those connections, but only the 1 set of 5.1 inputs. That is what poses a problem.

[Sckott]

Yes and no.

For instance, I have a seperate DVD player, just an inexpensive Apex (because it will play VCDs, DVDs and has other neato featues) and IT goes into a coax input which goes directly into my preamp. That's Video2. Behind the preamp, you put in either a pair of RCA analog, or the coax. Because I wanted real Dolby Digital or DTS, that's why I used coax there.

My SACD player, like most, has 5.1 analogs as well as a pair of RCAs. I took the pair of RCAs and brought it to "CD Player". I also ran the optical to the preamp as another input so I can use my DTS Cds as well as other direct-digital stuff like MiniDisc. That's as Video4, because it detects DTS and the preamp acts accordingly, and instantly.

Here's what I did with the 5.1:

The Rotel, as well as some receve's, use a serial/parallel port DB25 cable connector. I took a spare printer cable, cut in, and soldered RCA's to the appropriate lines. The layout of the connector goes left, center, right - ect starting with pin 1 & 14 for Left, 2 & 15 for Center, etc ect....

So if I want to use the 5.1 on demand, I just hit the button and that toggles on/off. It can also be used to go directly to a 6 channel amp emplying a similar DB25 layout.

So, I have the DVD using a single RCA matrix coax digitally, the SACD player uses both optical and 2 RCA for either "video 4" or "CD player" respectively, and the 5.1 has it's own "in".

Some receivers can't do this. Does this help in any way?? Sorry for the misunderstanding.

[Sckott]

Hmm... This might provide a better visual than looking in my profile! :)

[Sckott]

.

[GoldenBoy]

Thanks Skott, unfortunately, I don't have DB25 connectors on mine, so your solution just won't work for me. I'm left still looking for some sort of outboard signal switcher. I've seen them for A/V setups, but I haven't seen any that handle 5.1, only the usual stereo RCA, S-Video etc. :(

[Todd Fredericks]

Sckott, you're naughty...

[gkhowell]

Here is one switcher that appears to be popular:

http://home.attbi.com/~shawnfogg/

Also, there is a box available at Radio Shack that switches between two sets of three input channels (so you would have to use two). I don't know how good the quality of that box is and it would be less convenient but they would be less expensive.

[GoldenBoy]

I thought of something last night that seems so simple to me now, I'd like to kick myself for not thinking of it before. Wouldn't it be much simpler to use something like an RCA splitter that would go 1 male to 2 female? all I would need is six of them and then I could just plug the splitters directly into the A/V receiver and use the two females to attach the two units, since I would not be using both at the same time ever, this would pose no problem at all. How does this sound to you folks? It seems a lot simpler and definitely a lot cheaper than the $200 it would cost me for gkhowell's suggestion.

[Todd Fredericks]

I know this sounds like a drag but have you considered just switching the wires when you feel the desire to listen to the other format in 5.1? I was considering buying or building a mono switch box to install after my phonstage (which doesn't have a switch) to make my life easier than switcing the 2 y-cables I use to combine channels but it only takes less than a minute to do this and I think I was just being lazy. Do you have easy access to the back of your receiver in your set-up?

Todd

[Sckott]

Sckott, you're naughty...

Yeah. Showing my RCA inputs in a public forum. :eek:

To be honest, there's only one way to listen to MCh SACD, and it's through either a preamp or receiver that accepts analogue 5.1.

The reasoning behind the DB25 was the fact that it offered analog in, and for someone like me, I easilly retro-fitted the wires coming out of a printer cable to soldered-RCA connections.

Switchers found at Radio Shack will work, but it's more of a mess than a help, and sometimes those boxes get noisy. I still have a stereo RCA gang box from RS. You have to hold onto it before you hit a button, because the weight of the lil' box is so light.

This was the main reason, as I had a nice simple Adcom, to upgrade. I wanted to get into home theatre, a preamp that had a tuner, RCA/Coax/Optical ability, many, many RCA options with the upgrade to an analogue 5.1. Little did I know that I would be using the DB25 for SACD.

This, and I was freshly into tubes at the time I changed these preamps. Whew.

Goldenboy, I WILL say this quite confidently. I have yet to hear a Mch SACD experience that made me go berzerk, and ditch the stereo mix. If you put off the Mch experience for a while as you're casually looking, that's cool too! :agree: You're not missing the world, or a experience that the artist intended.

[GoldenBoy]

Skott,

I'm not casually looking, I already own an SACD player and an A/V Receiver and I have many Mch SACD's already that I occasionally do listen to in multichannel for the experience. I'd have to say that, like yourself, for the most part I have found that I really prefer the Stereo mixes of the SACD's to the Mch versions with the exceptions of Peter Tosh's Legalize It, the Gaudeamus Sacred Feast disc and, for some of the songs at least, Billy Joel's The Stranger. As you know, with DVD-A, it's pretty much Mch or nothing, with the stereo mixes actually being fold downs of the Mch mix done on the fly by the player itself! So I do know what I am or am not missing. :) As for what the artist intended, I think that is more of a problem probably with the older reissues as opposed to new releases like the Indigo Girls' Become You Mch-SACD or Bjork's Vespertine DVD-A. I find it hard to believe that the artists in those cases had no input whatsoever into the final Mch mix of those releases. Again, I agree with you about the older releases however, like the Eagles DVD-A's or the Queen DVD-A.

Anyway, I think I've solved my own problem by using RCA splitters, 2-female to 1-male on my A/V 5.1 inputs. I just bought 7 of them from Crutchfield (7 so I can also use one to split the video signal from my DVD player). :)

[JohnG]

Goldenboy, check out this alternative:

http://home.attbi.com/~shawnfogg/

[GoldenBoy]

Originally posted by JohnG
Goldenboy, check out this alternative:

http://home.attbi.com/~shawnfogg/

Thanks John, but gkhowell already posted that link, and I've checked it out. I don't really see any reason to spend $200 to do something that can be more easily and cheaply accomplished by using the RCA splitters. :) Again, I thank you very much for your help anyhow. :cool:

[vex]

Ugh, please don't use splitters to accomplish this task. You will only compromise the playback quality of both players. This is easy to test. Hook up both your players with your splitters in place and listen to one of them. Now, wire one of the channels directly to your receiver, bypassing the splitter. I'm sure you will notice a big, positive difference in that channel. Best thing is to get a switchbox. A good quality DB-25 switch is a great way to go. Your receiver does not need to have a DB-25 connector for this to work. All you need are three custom cables (single DB-25 to 6 RCA) and one DB-25 switchbox (preferably with a gold plated switch.) You can get an A/B switch to handle two multi-channel devices, or go with a four-way switch for future expansion. The solution available at http://home.attbi.com/~shawnfogg/ looks interesting, but I don't have experience with it.

[GoldenBoy]

Just to understand more completely and not in any way to challenge your assertion about splitters I ask you why exactly would a splitter degrade the sound? Isn't it really just acting as a pass through device just as a switcher is? Also, are there any other devices out there that you know of besides the one at http://home.attbi.com/~shawnfogg/ ? I really would not want to purchase something that I or hardly anyone else that has responded here knows anything about. Especially when it costs $200. :)

[vex]

Why? I don't know why. When it comes to the technical stuff, I'm just a goof. All I know is from experience. It's a simple experiment for you to try and won't cost you a dime (unless you haven't purchased your splitters already, but I got the impression you already had.)

Anyway, with a splitter, both devices are "active" at the same time (even if the other device is off, it is still physically connected.) With a switchbox, only one device is physically connected at a time.

I don't know why it makes a difference, but it does.

[JonUrban]

"Why not a splitter"?

The impedance of the non-used unit will affect the signal between the used unit and the reciever. It is a loading issue.

[GoldenBoy]

Oh. I didn't think of that. That is true. Thanks. So that $200 unit is looking like the only way to go. So there are no other switchers out there that handle 5.1? I just find that to be unbelievable. I've been searching everywhere and can't find a thing. :shake:

[JohnG]

Nothing official at this time. It's a shame the Outlaw Audio didn't think of adding two 5.1 inputs into their ICBM unit.

That would have really been great!

JohnG