Stones - Got Live If You Want It

[lukpac]

With all of the Stones reissue talk out there, I went back and took another listen to this one. This has to be the strangest production not only in the Stones' catalog, but maybe anywhere. A rundown:

The album claims to be recorded at the Royal Albert Hall, but right off the bat it's quite clear that two songs, "I've Been Loving You Too Long" and "Fortune Teller" are studio recordings with crowd noise overdubs. And sessions books claim that the live tracks were actually recorded at other gigs in the UK, with vocal overdubs in the studio. Still no big deal, right?

Well, no. Where to start? Well, right off the bat Under My Thumb is pretty strange - the entire music track is a dirty mess, while the vocals are anything but - Mick sounds like he could be in your living room. This is the pattern for most songs on the album. Plus, the instrumental track has what *sounds* like bells or a vibraphone (or something similar), which obviously wasn't used on stage. So much for the backing track being "live".

Satisfaction has a piano. Once again, not used on stage.

Then there's the matter of the "crowd". It's plainly obvious this is faked on the two "studio" tracks, and while it sounds different on the "live" tracks, it doesn't sound very real, either. I wonder if perhaps there's *some* live crowd on there with more overdubbed or something.

Next up, the editing. On the original stereo mix, there are some STRANGE hard edits. Have You Seen Your Mother goes right into Satisfaction with a very disturbing jump in the stereo spectrum. There's something similar just before 19th Nervous Breakdown.

But wait, there's more! I'm Alright uses the SAME backing track that the UK "Got Live" EP did a year earlier, but the vocals are new, matching the others on the LP. At least that track clearly wasn't recorded at the other UK shows from which the album is claimed to have come from.

I've never heard the original mono mix, but the more or less mono mix on the old ABKCO CD opens up a whole new can of worms. First off, the intro is different. On the stereo LP, the stage announcer announces Bill Wyman, after which the announcement starts to fade out (you can hear a bit more if you listen closely) and Under My Thumb starts. On the CD, there's a different announcement, and the whole band is introduced (it's not simply an "unedited" version of the original).

On first listen one would think the version of Under My Thumb was different on the CD, since the intro is different and it has different vocals. However, the backing track is indeed the same as the LP version, and there's a small edit in the intro to account for the differences.

The editing between songs is also very different. It seems like there's more overdubbed crowd noise on the CD (on a loop), and some of the edits between songs are different. For instance, there's now some "space" between Mick's "thank you, thank you very much..." bit and Have You Seen Your Mother, while they went straight together on the LP. Same thing with Have You Seen Your Mother and Satisfaction.

On the original LP, Satisfaction fades out. On the CD, it fades out BUT the crowd noise stays up. And there's some "extra" stuff at the end.

I think this goes in my book as the WORST produced "live recording" out there. The sound quality itself, especially on the vocals, which are really good, but as a whole it's just a sloppy mess. I really wonder what they'll give us on the SACD...

[Steve Hoffman]

It is the worst.

I bought this album with my hard earned pennies (mowing lawns, etc.) in 1966 and hated it from first listen. Just a bad recording. I wanted Fortune Teller, damn it, and it was never released as a single in the USA, but they played it on the radio all the time, and I loved it. So, I thought even a live version would do.

Of course, it was the real version with fake crowd, but, at least in stereo, I could turn one channel off and get most of the song without the crowd.

Imagine my thrill when my buddy John Oteri actually found the 45 version of Fortune Teller. He had to get it from "the land down under" but he got it. (It has "Sad Day" on the B side).

At any rate, "Got Live" really bites. I didn't know that it wasn't released in England originally, just Germany. And, yes, I have the German versions and they bite too.

:rolleyes:

[lukpac]

Originally posted by Steve Hoffman
I bought this album with my hard earned pennies (mowing lawns, etc.) in 1966 and hated it from first listen. Just a bad recording. I wanted Fortune Teller, damn it, and it was never released as a single in the USA, but they played it on the radio all the time, and I loved it. So, I thought even a live version would do.

Of course, it was the real version with fake crowd, but, at least in stereo, I could turn one channel off and get most of the song without the crowd.

Imagine my thrill when my buddy John Oteri actually found the 45 version of Fortune Teller. He had to get it from "the land down under" but he got it. (It has "Sad Day" on the B side).

You do know that a version without crowd noise can be found on CD on "More Hot Rocks", right? I'd have to consult David Goodwin here, but I think the ABKCO and London CDs feature slightly different versions (different overdubs).

[Sckott]

Many Stones fans avoid even purchasing this record. It's a slaughter. Not accurate either sonically or historically. It exists as a bad record on its own, for itself. A very poor rush job, and basically out for the sake of live concert promotion of the Stones.

Dammed if they do anything better for the new reissues.

[Steve Hoffman]

Originally posted by lukpac


You do know that a version without crowd noise can be found on CD on "More Hot Rocks", right? I'd have to consult David Goodwin here, but I think the ABKCO and London CDs feature slightly different versions (different overdubs).

Sure, I have it. But I wanted it THEN! Heck, if the Stones had been on Capitol, it would have been a single release. Those dudes released everything on 45.

[RDK]

It's funny because "More Hot Rocks" was actually the first Stones lp that I ever bought - so "Fortune teller" (a great song!) was just always there.

Ray

[Steve Hoffman]

I think in 1966 London had pressed up some promo 45's of "Fortune Teller" and serviced radio, then changed their mind (or it was changed for them).

KRLA and KFWB pounced on "Fortune Teller" and played it every hour. Imagine going into a record store and not being able to buy it on 45 OR LP.

Stupido!

[lukpac]

Originally posted by Steve Hoffman
I think in 1966 London had pressed up some promo 45's of "Fortune Teller" and serviced radio, then changed their mind (or it was changed for them).

KRLA and KFWB pounced on "Fortune Teller" and played it every hour. Imagine going into a record store and not being able to buy it on 45 OR LP.

Stupido!

That's interesting. The song dates from 1963, and I know Decca released it on one of their LPs - Saturday Club if memory serves. I wonder why London would have been pushing it in 1966.

[Steve Hoffman]

Not just London USA, but Decca World wide (my single is from Aussie Decca).

Were they short of Stones product in late 1966? I always assumed the song was recorded in '66, as was "Sad Day". Now I'm totally confused.

[lukpac]

Originally posted by Steve Hoffman
Were they short of Stones product in late 1966? I always assumed the song was recorded in '66, as was "Sad Day". Now I'm totally confused.

Noooooooooo...:)

Fortune Teller was done in the UK in mid-1963, several months before the first LP sessions. Originally released on "Saturday Club" in early 1964 in the UK. A horrible recording, really. Note that it's mono on Got Live, while I've Been Loving You Too Long is stereo (which had been cut at the same sessions as Satisfaction in 1965).

Sad Day was cut in December 1965 for the "Could You Walk On The Water" sessions. That got scrapped, and some tracks came out as singles, some came out on Aftermath, and some were unreleased. Sad Day showed up as the US B-side to 19th Nervous Breakdown, and as a UK single in 1973.

[Steve Hoffman]

Wow, I've learned something today.

Luke,

WHICH version was on the Saturday Club LP? The "underdub" or the version with the background vocals, etc.?

[RetroSmith]

As bad as GLIYWI is, try The Ventures On Stage, Around The World".

They overdubbed the SAME applause after every track!! The same guy whistles in the same place!!! Every Track!!

On top of that, the overdubbed Don Wilsons voice in the studio (clear as a bell) announcing "Heres One We Did on a Single Record.....Slaughter On 10th Avenue". Its so clear, its funny.


The really wierd thing is that these are truly live recordings, made in Japan. he Japanese audiences were so polite that Liberty felt they HAD to overdub crown noise to kmake the concert seem real.

As always, The Ventures playing is just GREAT, tho.

[Sckott]

Mikey,

Thanks for the heads up. I have to 'master' a bunch of Ventures LPs to CD this weekend for a buddy. Groan.

Must have been a conforting thing to be a rock and roll manager and just say "OD some audience noice on it, bravo!"

[lukpac]

Originally posted by Steve Hoffman
WHICH version was on the Saturday Club LP? The "underdub" or the version with the background vocals, etc.?

Boy, you've got me. Like I've said, David Goodwin is the resident expert on this one. Here's what he has to say:

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4140&highlight=fortune+teller

Re Got Live, while I've never concretely straightened out which versions correspond to which LP pressings, here's how Fortune Teller ends up on CD:

a) The ABKCO CD has a version with no harmonica, and extra handclaps/tambourine/noise. This shows up WITHOUT CROWD NOISE on either the ABKCO More Hot Rocks or Singles Collection (I'm almost positive as to the latter, but not as to the former...again, I don't own these things...^_^)

b) The London stereo CD has a version without some of the overdubs that the above has, but with harmonica and sounding a lot more "studio." It has crowd noise on the Got Live CD, but due to the way the album's mixed, the crowd noise can be completely eliminated by getting rid of one of the channels. Moot point, though, because this version of Fortune Teller shows up sans noise on More Hot Rocks 2. As this one matches the versions that showed up on vinyl, it leads me to believe taht ABKCO's issuing of the first version sans noise actually generates something of a rarity, as I doubt that one was intended to exist off of Got Live.

It's still pretty confusing!

[Steve Hoffman]

Don't you think it's weird that "Fortune Teller" was never released on a Stones album, EP or single back then? I mean, if it was recorded in 1963, why did they leave it in the can?

Why did they wait until '66 to even dredge it up again?

[Jeff H.]

Originally posted by Steve Hoffman
Don't you think it's weird that "Fortune Teller" was never released on a Stones album, EP or single back then? I mean, if it was recorded in 1963, why did they leave it in the can?

Why did they wait until '66 to even dredge it up again?


Good question. Do you think it released as a single in other countries in place of "Mother's Little Helper" which was the follow up to "Paint It Black" in the US?

[lukpac]

Originally posted by Steve Hoffman
Don't you think it's weird that "Fortune Teller" was never released on a Stones album, EP or single back then? I mean, if it was recorded in 1963, why did they leave it in the can?

Why did they wait until '66 to even dredge it up again?

Well, then again, why did they leave a lot of stuff in the can?

My Girl sat unreleased for more than 2 years in the US, and about 8 in the UK (assuming a mid-1965 recording date).

You Better Move On was cut in September 1963, released in the UK in early 1964, and not released in the US till November 1965.

You'll go crazy trying to figure out what was released where and when, and you might kill yourself trying to figure out why!

[krabapple]

Is "Get yer Ya Yas Out" all live or has it too been 'enhanced' with studoi material?

[Vivaldinization]

Originally posted by lukpac


You do know that a version without crowd noise can be found on CD on "More Hot Rocks", right? I'd have to consult David Goodwin here, but I think the ABKCO and London CDs feature slightly different versions (different overdubs).

Coming into this a bit late, but...

Yes. The ABKCO mono CD (not sure about the LP) has a version with different overdubs that turns up, unceremoniously, without crowd noise on the Singles Collection (and MAYBE their More Hot Rocks). The London stereo disc, meanwhile, has a version with all crowd noise in the left channel and the song only in the right, and THAT version (with harmonica overdubs and less percussion) is on the London More Hot Rocks disc. I believe the latter is the single version, and the former was never meant to be heard without crowd noise, as it's obviously overdubbed to seem more "live."

-D

[Vivaldinization]

Originally posted by David Goodwin


Coming into this a bit late, but...


-D

Teaches me not to raed the entire thread before posting..^_^

FWIW, I've always thought that Fortune Teller sounded decent...the one on More Hot Rocks is mono, but very crisp and punchy.

-D

[Vivaldinization]

Originally posted by lukpac


Well, then again, why did they leave a lot of stuff in the can?

My Girl sat unreleased for more than 2 years in the US, and about 8 in the UK (assuming a mid-1965 recording date).

You Better Move On was cut in September 1963, released in the UK in early 1964, and not released in the US till November 1965.

You'll go crazy trying to figure out what was released where and when, and you might kill yourself trying to figure out why!

I mean, it's the December's Children phenomenon...look what vintage some of the tracks are on that thing (e.g. You Better Move On). If December's Children hadn't presented itself (i.e., say the Stones had taken that year off in recording), where woudl they have shoved that? Aftermath?

-D