Suggestions wanted: Need New SACD Player.

[Khorn]

Hi,

Maybe some of you can help me out. I'll be moving shortly and my main system is in mothballs for the time being. When I set up again next month I want a new front end and have decided to go SACD. It is important that as well as SACD the machine will be able to play back red book cd on the level of let's say something like the new Musical Fidelity A3 24/192 DAC or some other equivalent unit.

The machines I am considering are:

1) Sony SCD XA777 ES.

The problem here is the price in Canada. They want around $4000 Canadian for this unit and, being such a new format with many machines to come over the next while this is maybe too much to spend.

2) Marantz SA 8260

This sounds like it might be a good choice, the price is right about $2000 Canadian tax in. The only worry here is that it is so new there isn't that much (any) pro review feedback to guide me.

Logic might dictate waiting as many new units will be coming out but, I want my system up and running soon after I move July 11 therefore I'll need to act soon.

If any of you out there can help with experienced advice on units such as the ones above or any others that I may not be aware of I would REALLY appreciate it.

tnx in advance

[Sckott]

Many are going after the XA777, but Sony has gotten a bad rap on the ES series in the AudioAsylum. I heard it and thought it was an awesome player.

Fact is, Steve mentioned more hi-rez players are in the shoots waiting to come out, and from what I understand, better units at lower prices. Best to wait, IMHO. It's why I bought the CE775 when I did. Great playback, guiltless pricetag.

DVD-A and SACD are at price wars right now too. You'll see- it'll make prices on players come down....

I hear the disc transport on the Marantz is sloppy, but I've never tried for myself.

[Khorn]

Originally posted by Sckott


I hear the disc transport on the Marantz is sloppy, but I've never tried for myself.


Thanks for your input Sckott, can you tell me where you heard about the transport problem that you describe?

[audiomixer]

I just picked up the Sony 775 & am quite happy with the performance and the D/A
converter built into it. Sounds very warm and analog. I was looking at the DVP-650
since it also had DVD built into it, but the look and build of the 775 is better in my
opinion...

I also have the single disc DVP-550 single disc DVD/SACD player. They both sound
good for the money!

[Sckott]

Originally posted by Khorn



Thanks for your input Sckott, can you tell me where you heard about the transport problem that you describe?

Wish I remembered. I think it may have been the Audioasylum. I really wish audioreview.com had more on SACD units, public opinion, ect.

When I was in radio, a lot of Marantz units we bought were broadcast-quality cassette machines for the "road". They were great, but I remember one of the engineers grumbling about the CDP units by Marantz. I think one of the stations in the same building uses them even to this day.

Buy a SACD (familiar title) and go shopping for the deck you feel most at home for.

[vex]

The Sony SCD XA777 ES player kicks some serious butt. It is the best CD player I have ever owned. I mean, it does the best job with regular ol' redbook than anything I've owned, and I've been through my fair share of players. Oh, but wait, it's a stereo/mulit-channel SACD player. I'm saying you get an awesome regular player out of the deal as well!

I'm not up on DSD technology, exactly how it works, and all that, but this player has six seperate DSD "converters" (or whatever the term is) which I believe is a unique feature for this unit. It uses one "converter" per channel for multi-channel playback but it combines three per channel for stereo playback. I don't know if it uses them in series or parallel, nor do I understand why this would make a difference, but it does. All I know is that the result is absolutely stunning. It has the most addictive sound of just about anything I've ever heard. For SACD's, this player sounds very sweet and "tube-like", if I were to compare it to anything. This is much more apparent with stereo SACD's but multi-channel SACD's are not being short-changed. You just get a little more of what you paid for in stereo.

[Khorn]

Originally posted by Sckott
Many are going after the XA777, but Sony has gotten a bad rap on the ES series in the AudioAsylum. I heard it and thought it was an awesome player.

Fact is, Steve mentioned more hi-rez players are in the shoots waiting to come out, and from what I understand, better units at lower prices. Best to wait, IMHO. It's why I bought the CE775 when I did. Great playback, guiltless pricetag.


I do realize that there will be newer better machines coming out but I'm caught in a time thing here. At present I don't have a front end worth talking about or listening to and want one along with a new 16:9 projection HD TV and DVD player as soon as possible after moving. The DVD player while primarily for video will also provide DVD-A playback for those must have WEA titles that probably won't be available on SACD any time in the near future. The presumption here is that none of the new all in one players equals the sound quality of a better single format player. This is the sense I get from reading the reviews of the multiformat machines.

My question is this: If I go for the XA777ES will this unit suffice for the next few years without being obsoleted?? Were talking relatively big bucks here and I want my investment to last a few years. From the reports so far it seems that the quality of build and playback of both SACD and redbook is about as good as one can get without going nuts (super multiple K's) dollar wise.

I guess I'm asking if any of you were in my position why or why not whould you make the move towards the Sony?

tnx again

[Sckott]

The XA777ES is an awesome unit, a lot of fun, and sounds fantastic. The reason I would go with Sony is because they hold the proprietary technology at this time.

At least at this point, it's best to buy technology from the people who are making it and authoring most discs. The deck is the real deal too, as I feel strongly that the Marantz while a good player, would possibly rate behind any Sony product in its class.

You can also just get a CE775 now, and let it propell you forward for 2-3 years. Wouldn't it make ya mad if a player 10X better comes out in a few years and you soaked yourself for $500 worth of depreciation and can't sell it on eBay for more than $200? Just a thought, and I know you're looking for a higher end machine, but that's how I feel right now.

[vex]

Originally posted by Khorn


My question is this: If I go for the XA777ES will this unit suffice for the next few years without being obsoleted?? Were talking relatively big bucks here and I want my investment to last a few years. From the reports so far it seems that the quality of build and playback of both SACD and redbook is about as good as one can get without going nuts (super multiple K's) dollar wise.

I guess I'm asking if any of you were in my position why or why not whould you make the move towards the Sony?

tnx again

I was in your same position when I decided to buy my XA777ES. At first I was going to wait for a GOOD universal player, but I already owned an incredible DVD-A player and didn't really want to part with it. Also, there is a lot that can be said for seperate, dedicated players.

There were enough SACD titles available that I really wanted and my impatience got the better of me, so I decided to take the plunge. It was just a matter of which current player to buy. I wanted the best stereo/multi-channel SACD player I could afford and I wanted one that would last me a lifetime.

Redbook performance wasn't a priority, but if it could excel there as well, that would be icing on the cake. I don't think the XA777ES will become obsolete, but it's almost a given that better performing players will come along at a cheaper price. That's just the nature of things. However, I am so impressed with this player, I'm convinced that anything better that comes along will be a marginal improvement in SACD performance at best. My decision to go with this player was based primarily on the rave reviews it has received, the fact that Sony "owns" the SACD format, and because of a recent (substantial) drop in price. I mean, this thing originally retailed for three grand!

If you want to get really carried away, people are already modding these machines to get even more performance out of them. Some of these mods are quit extensive and can cost more than the player itself! So, for me, worst case is I start modding the thing, but I plan on keeping it in my system for as long as I own SACD discs. There are already enough SACD titles on the market that even if SACD were to die tomorrow, I would be quite content for years to come (media death has never been a deterent for me!)

Anyway, that's my story. Something that might be worth checking out is the Philips SACD-1000 player that can now be had for about half what the XA777ES goes for. I don't have experience with the SACD-1000, but it is Philips own top-of-the-line stereo/multi SACD player and they were partners with Sony in SACD's development, so...

Just for kicks, here are some links to the XA777ES mods I mentioned:

http://www.audience-av.com/777es.htm

http://www.modwright.com/products/absolute_truth.php

http://www.tweakaudio.com/EVS%20modified%20SACD%20players.html

Happy hunting!

[MikeT]

I would second vex's comments. The XA777ES is quite a player.

All I can tell you is that of all the CD/SACD players I own, when I play either a redbook CD or SACD in my XA777ES I usually sit mesmerized at the sound quality.

My wife says that when I am playing music on my "overpriced CD player" I sit like a zombie staring off into space. She says I am a real weirdo. :D

What is actually happening is that the sound quality of the music is SO good, I become transfixed and actually climb inside the music as opposed to listening to it (if you know what I mean).

No other player has ever had that effect on me before.

Off topic - I have recently put an MMF-5 TT in my system after not having the means to playback vinyl in my system for near 10 years, and with the right vinyl I get the same effect as the XA777ES. ;)

[KeithH]

Sony has gotten a bad rap on the ES series in the AudioAsylum.

I don't agree with this statement. A lot of regulars at Audio Asylum, myself included, are happy owners of Sony ES SACD players. However, I will concede that there have been a fair number of people who have problems with their ES players. There were problems with the SCD-777ES and SCD-1 early on, and others have had problems with the SCD-C333ES. On the whole, however, I think most people over there are happy with their purchases of ES SACD players.

[KeithH]

Mike, I thought your 'XA777ES went in for a repair. What ever happened there?

[MikeT]

Originally posted by KeithH
Mike, I thought your 'XA777ES went in for a repair. What ever happened there?

Keith,
Hey!!

I got my XA777ES back in pristine condition from the Sony Service Center in Westwood, MA, roughly two weeks to the day that I sent it in for repair.

Needless to say, it was fixed to my full expectations. All the redbook CDs that caused problems, work fine now. And, although this may just be part of my imagination, SACD playback seems better than ever.

Last night I listened to the Patricia Barber "Cafe Blue" SACD from the newly resurrected MOFI, and the sound quality was STUNNING!!! The music may not appeal to everyone, since it is very offbeat jazz with very offbeat smokey cool vocal stylings by Ms. Barber, but if you want to hear SACD done right - the Patricia Barber SACD titles are worth a listen.

Back to the original topic at hand - I feel Sony has done right by me with the repair of my XA777ES. I was a bit worried, hearing Sony service horror stories (your mini-disc repair saga included), but when the double-boxed player was returened to me in excellent condition, I breathed a sigh of relief.:)

Thanks for asking.

[bmoura]

Originally posted by Khorn
Hi,
The machines I am considering are:

1) Sony SCD XA777 ES.

The problem here is the price in Canada. They want around $4000 Canadian for this unit and, being such a new format with many machines to come over the next while this is maybe too much to spend.

2) Marantz SA 8260

This sounds like it might be a good choice, the price is right about $2000 Canadian tax in. The only worry here is that it is so new there isn't that much (any) pro review feedback to guide me.

tnx in advance

I'd suggest checking with Oade Brothers (www.oade.com) on a new SACD player. They sell the XA777ES for $2,000 (vs. $3,000 list price) and also have a deal going on the Philips SACD-1000 for only $795 (vs. $2,000 list price).

Both are fine SACD players.

[Marc Pool]

I own a Philips SACD-1000 and I'm really happy with that one.

A plays well up to the limits of my set up.

Considering the price they are asking for it in the US it's a great deal!

[sgb]

Originally posted by Sckott


I hear the disc transport on the Marantz is sloppy, but I've never tried for myself.
You heard wrong. I own one. The Marantz is like driving a Lexus compared to a Sentra in terms of its comparison to the 777.

You're right, the 777's are riddled with problems as noted on the AA board.

[Khorn]

Originally posted by sgb

You heard wrong. I own one. The Marantz is like driving a Lexus compared to a Sentra in terms of its comparison to the 777.

You're right, the 777's are riddled with problems as noted on the AA board.

Which Marantz do you have?

[Marc Pool]

The Marantz do seem to have a bit of a reputation. I just posted about the Marantz on audioasylum as well.
A few months back I went to an audio shop to listen to a couple of Martin Logan's. I asked for a SACD demo machine because that's what I listen to most. They had the SA-1 and it failed to open. The disc inside was stuck or something. After a bit of stress from the sales guy (and me because I only brought one CD to listen to and several SACD's) one of the other sales guys came into the listening room and gave a big slap against the machine. After which it opened.

I have to say this was the demo machine from the importers but still the salesman told me it was a well know Marantz problem. Don't know if it's true but I have heard about the same problem a couple of times after that.

On the other hand it is by far the best SACD I had a change of listening to. Sound wise it outplays everything I have heard so far. Can't afford it though..... :(

[sgb]

I have the SA-14. The 8260 borrows many of its part (including the drive mechanism) from the more expensive SA-14 (suggested list - U.S. Dollars $2995).

I chose the 14 because I wanted a stereo-only player. Although I had considered waiting for the 8260 to come out, this was based on the initial announcements that it would not be multi-channel. When I found that it would be M-C, I ordered the SA-14.

(The SA-1 Referred to in the previous post uses a different drive in the earlier versions of it. There were several updates to the SA-1 before it was discontinued.)

[Todd Fredericks]

When I was listening to some SACD players a few months ago (a friend wanted one) I ecountered a similair Marantz door problem. We ended up listening to some Sony models because the salesperson couldn't get the door open (10 minutes trying). He said this was the second demo unit to have the door fail (he wasn't too pleased). I love the sliding lid on the Sony SCD-1...

Todd

[Khorn]

Originally posted by sgb

You heard wrong. I own one. The Marantz is like driving a Lexus compared to a Sentra in terms of its comparison to the 777.

You're right, the 777's are riddled with problems as noted on the AA board.

Which Marantz do you have?

[sgb]

Originally posted by Todd Fredericks
When I was listening to some SACD players a few months ago (a friend wanted one) I ecountered a similair Marantz door problem. We ended up listening to some Sony models because the salesperson couldn't get the door open (10 minutes trying). He said this was the second demo unit to have the door fail (he wasn't too pleased). I love the sliding lid on the Sony SCD-1...

Todd

So, which model Marantz was it? There are 4 of them, you know.

Glad you like that liding lid on the SCD-1 (It's on the original 777 too), how does the lid sound?

[sgb]

Originally posted by Khorn


Which Marantz do you have?

I think this was already asked and answered above.

SA-14.

[Khorn]

Originally posted by sgb


I think this was already asked and answered above.

SA-14.

tnx my error, double post (don't ask, I'm the only one that could have done it ). :rolleyes:

How is the redbook on the SA-14? All we hear about is how good the Sony is in that regard. Are there any published tests of this unit? From what I can tell so far it looks like it is built like a tank. I've still got a few weeks before I have to decide unless the Sony SCD1 (no-brainer at the price) I've been hearing about comes available to me and therefore the Marantz is still under consideration but, getting experienced info is like pulling teeth.
Do you think that the extra build quality audibly makes a difference over the newer 8260? Like you, all I really need is stereo.

[Todd Fredericks]

The Marantz I saw with jammed tray/door was the SA-14. The salesman thought it was a bad production run on the batch he got. He thought despite this problem the Marantz player was wonderful and one of the best out there (not that there are that many to choose from?). He also believed that Marantz was working on correcting problem (Why do these companies release units with bugs??). We didn't know what to think. The unit looked very nice but we couldn't listen to it. The door (or hatch) on the Sony SCD-1 was pretty silent when sliding open & closed. My friends father has owned it for a few years (when ever it came out) and has had no problems. The SCD-1 is a beautiful looking & sounding machine...

Todd