Hey, Gang...!! There's a **BIG** price drop on the laser turntables...

[Joel Cairo]

(Gort & Gort, Jr.-- I know this technically belongs in the Hardware section, but I thought that it might be of interest to the larger general forum membership... if you **have** to move it though, feel free!!)

It looks like the folks at:

http://www.elpj.com/

who, as you recall, sell the oh-so-cool laser turntables, **really ** want to give us a shot at actually owning one... take a look at their new prices!

(OK-- it's not like any of us are going to rush out and buy two or three, but it is **much** more affordable, and definitely now within the realm of possibility...)

-Kevin

[petzi]

Originally posted by Joel Cairo
__________________
********************

When in Hollywood, visit Universal Studios (Ask for Babs)

You like the Blues Brothers ?

[Grant]

Not only are they still way out of my price range, I understand that the laser picks up every vinyl defect you can imagine, and that it's worse than having a standard TT. The way I understand it, they can't negotiate records with slight warps or off-center records very well.

No thanks.

[Joel Cairo]

Grant:

I recall talking to the guy who ran Finial Technologies back in '89, and he mentioned the potential for problems with off-center records, though he did also mention that records with a **slight** warp didn't affect the tracking of the laser stylus.

And it seems to me that with so much audiophile vinyl out there, there would be a greater interest in a playback system that didn't degrade the LP-- if I were shelling out for those 180-gram CCR's, I'd be **very** interested in making sure that they stayed in pristine condition.

And to minimize dirt, etc., the LTT comes with what I understand is a very thorough record cleaner, which most people would use anyway...I don't know anyone who purposely plays dirty records.

I think the thing that interests me most is the fact that it's an analog system, so in a sense it works along the same principal as a laserdisc video system. And therefore, theoretically, it should deliver about the best sound possible for playback.

I'd just love to see if anyone on the board has ever heard one, or had a chance to A/B test one.


-Kevin


[Petzi:

Yes, but I'm a bigger fan of "Animal House" (which is where the whole thing started...) BTW- Did you know that until fairly recently, if you **did** ask for Babs at the Universal Studios tour, you got in free??)]

[lukpac]

Originally posted by Grant
Not only are they still way out of my price range, I understand that the laser picks up every vinyl defect you can imagine, and that it's worse than having a standard TT.

Actually, according to the stuff on the website, it can "gloss over" certain things that a normal turntable would pick up. It *is* however (again, according to the website) more sensitive to dirt. Hence the included cleaner.

[Grant]

Originally posted by lukpac


Actually, according to the stuff on the website, it can "gloss over" certain things that a normal turntable would pick up. It *is* however (again, according to the website) more sensitive to dirt. Hence the included cleaner.

From *my* point of view, unless you have lots of perfectly flat, perfectly centered virgin vinyl pressings, what's the point? All that money could go into buying more vinyl to enjoy on a regular TT.

[Joel Cairo]

Well, even from an archival/preservation standpoint, it makes sense to **me**, and as I recall, there's at least one institution in Canda (I think it's in Toronto) that has invested in one, and this was before the price drop. The fact that you'd get superior reproduction quality is a wonderful added bonus!!

And when you consider the prices that some people pay for conventional high-end TT's, I think this may represent a tremendous opportunity to achieve the same sound quality, without the downside of frictional groove deterioration.

Even though the majority of these players have been sold in Japan (the Land of Decent Pressings), I'm reasonably certain that your records don't need to have originated from there to work just fine, generally speaking.

-Kevin

[Grant]

I guess if you play records a lot...I don't.

[petzi]

Originally posted by Joel Cairo

[Petzi:

Yes, but I'm a bigger fan of "Animal House" (which is where the whole thing started...) BTW- Did you know that until fairly recently, if you **did** ask for Babs at the Universal Studios tour, you got in free??)]


Way cool ! Did you try it out ? I didn´t have enough time to visit Hollywood last time I was in California.

I didn´t know Animal House before. This appears to be a running gag that spans multiple movies ?!

[lukpac]

Originally posted by Grant
From *my* point of view, unless you have lots of perfectly flat, perfectly centered virgin vinyl pressings, what's the point?

And who said you needed a perfectly flat, perfectly centered virgin vinyl pressing?

[Grant]

Originally posted by lukpac


And who said you needed a perfectly flat, perfectly centered virgin vinyl pressing?

Look, for me, I don't see any point in getting one of these tables with all the potential playback problems. If I *had* that kind of disposable cash, i'd rather buy a cheaper, yet good TT and more vinyl to transfer to that big, bad digital CD-R!

Besides, from what I understand, those things don't cue up tracks very well. I can't use it.:rolleyes:

[David R. Modny]

I'd be curious as to how the latest version actually *sounds* in terms of frequency response deviations, as compared to the original Finial that was reviewed by the "audiophile" press when they were still 40 thousand smackers.

At the time, there seemed to be a consensus that, wear and tracking issues aside, the best cartridges still "sounded" better. Also, what are the sonic results of a severely damaged groove wall? Again, not for noise but, for frequency reponse repercussions. No wear is the calling card...but truly superior sound is what will make or break it at this new price level, IMO.

PS - Do they still offer the lifetime warranty that the original Finial had? I believe they don't anymore...how long will the laser assembly last before a new one is needed? Another BIG factor for me!

[David R. Modny]

Also, what they need on that site and what they actually USED to have - sound clips (preferably high-quality 20 second, non-lossy uncompressed WAV snippets) of perhaps the table going head to head with a conventional rig. Maybe, also showing how they handle a beat to crap record (assuming that they wouldn't cheat and add any secret post-processing). That might be fun!.

[lukpac]

Originally posted by David R. Modny
Also, what they need on that site and what they actually USED to have - sound clips (preferably high-quality 20 second, non-lossy uncompressed WAV snippets) of perhaps the table going head to head with a conventional rig.

Don't they? I thought I saw that just the other day.

[Ben]

Thirteen Grand for the bottom end?

And these are the new LOW prices!


Laughing.....a sucker born every minute.

Too bad they can't animate that guys face on their home page to do what he really does anytime some poor sucker actually antes up....



Too funny!


Best to the Board,


Ben

(laser turntables for $23,000.....hah!)

[David R. Modny]

Originally posted by lukpac


Don't they? I thought I saw that just the other day.


I see the QuickTime movie, but that's all I can find. Post links if you find 'em.

[Joel Cairo]

Ben:

Actually the product is quite legitimate-- they've been around since the late 80's. As I mentioned earlier, there's at least one institution that I've heard of that has purchased one in the past.

And I'm not sure where you're picking up the prices that you mentioned-- the new prices are $5,990 for the low end unit, 7.990 for the mid-line and $8,990 for the top of the line machine. That's why I was referring to the new lower prices.

(Not that they're in my **current** budget yet, but they're a lot closer than they **were**!!)

-Kevin

[Ben]

Okay...got the right price now...


I'm sure the product is legit....I guess maybe I just went into sticker shock....


Geez - that's a lot of vinyl that could be bought following the purchase of a great $2G rig....


Best,

Ben

[Grant]

Originally posted by Ben



Geez - that's a lot of vinyl that could be bought following the purchase of a great $2G rig....


Best,

Ben

Ben, that was my veiw as well!

[Paul Chang]

They were already more "affordable" than top of the line turntables made by Rockport, Forsell, Basis, Clearaudio and Walker, some of which do not include a tonearm let alone a phono cartridge, even before the price reduction. Now they are priced at the VPI TNT Mk. V level. Remember, these ELPs are complete turntables with the laser pickup included. :cool: If only NASDAQ and DJIA will bounce back to their previous highs ...

My not-yet-a-friend David is concerned about the lifetime of the laser pickup. My uneducated guess is that it will outlast a conventional phono cartridge. When was the last time you had the laser in your CD player replaced?

Thanks for the notice, Joel. :)

[Paul Chang]

I mean thanks, Kevin. Or should I call you Joel? :confused:

[Paul Chang]

Originally posted by Grant
Not only are they still way out of my price range, I understand that the laser picks up every vinyl defect you can imagine, and that it's worse than having a standard TT. The way I understand it, they can't negotiate records with slight warps or off-center records very well.

No thanks. Grant,

IMO, we audiophiles should not pass judgment on how a piece of hardware will work or sound until we give it a serious audition - the same rule that applies to software. :)

[Grant]

Originally posted by Paul Chang
Grant,

IMO, we audiophiles should not pass judgment on how a piece of hardware will work or sound until we give it a serious audition - the same rule that applies to software. :)
I hope everybody remembers that the next time a vinyl vs. CD debate pops up.;)

[Dave B]

I'm very interested in hearing this thing. I wonder if they will be demo'ing them at the New York Audio show? I have my ticket already. If I get to hear one I'll post a review. It's still a bit out of my reach but getting closer. Another price drop and we might be there. I'd still keep my analog rig for those discs that won't play on the laser table for one reason or another.

[TSmithPage]

Hey, it's on my list of things to buy... just as soon as I win that lottery. :D