Denon S-301 HTiB (Home Theatre in a Box, 2.1 Virtual Surround Sound)

[nukevor]

I've been thinking about getting this thing for my bedroom, eventually. Very small (footprint) and slick:

http://usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/476.asp
http://simple.denon.com/s301.asp

If I get it, the S-301 would replace by Bose Wave CD Radio. (Yep, I bought into to the Bose hype--unfortunately--almost 8 years ago, before I discovered this forum.)

The S-301 is advertised as a HTiB, but it looks more like a mini system to my eyes. To my knowledge, it does not have an alarm clock. Oh well. On the up side, it plays just about every optical disc format on the planet, including HDCD, SACD and DVD-A. It also has a USB plug, an iPod plug and an HDMI plug for HDTVs.

The other reason for contemplating purchase: In the past few months, I've noticed Fry's Electronics has been advertising it at a discount--around the $799-$899 price point--after instant savings (normally priced at $1199). As of today, I see an ad for it for $799 after instant savings.

At that price, it would be worth it, especially compared with the Polk I-Sonic Mini System (http://isonic.polkaudio.com/index.php), just a bit less at $599. The only thing the I-Sonic has that the Denon doesn't is the HD and satellite radio options. (Now that XM & Sirius plan to merge, I wonder how that's going to work?)

The MSRP of the S-301 was originally advertised at $1599, which makes me wonder if Denon is heavily discounting the thing to adjust for the latest iteration of the device (Blu-Ray and/or HD-DVD versions?) down the line. If I get it, this would be my first SACD player.

Of course, plan to demo the S-301 before anything else...and I'm not sure about this virtual surround feature. It could be cool, it could be not**.

As far as getting a TV for it, that's way down the line for me.
________________________________________ ________________________
**Now, if there is a way to modify it so I can add extra 3 speakers...

[Feisal K]

my old Denon M30 could be programmed to switch on or off on time, I'd be surprised if the S301 didn't have similar functionality. seems pretty expensive if you were to buy the DVD player without wanting to use the video capability - perhaps an M33 would cost less but you would give up SACD and DVDA

[soundboy]

Have you considered Onkyo's CS-V720S (http://www.shoponkyo.com/detail.cfm?productid=CS-V720S&modelid=8&group_id=1&detail=1&ext_war=1) at $400.00?

DVD-A, SACD, DVD, CD, XM-compatible tuner, dts, Dolby Digital, Dolby Pro-Logic II, etc. Even pre-outs for 5.1 channels.

[nukevor]

Have you considered Onkyo's CS-V720S (http://www.shoponkyo.com/detail.cfm?productid=CS-V720S&modelid=8&group_id=1&detail=1&ext_war=1) at $400.00?

DVD-A, SACD, DVD, CD, XM-compatible tuner, dts, Dolby Digital, Dolby Pro-Logic II, etc. Even pre-outs for 5.1 channels.

I've seen this advertised before and actually saw one at Fry's Electronics last year. Just briefly fiddled with it. Wasn't too impressed. Might have to compare the two side by side, if that is even possible.

my old Denon M30 could be programmed to switch on or off on time, I'd be surprised if the S301 didn't have similar functionality.

Are you referring to an alarm clock type feature?

seems pretty expensive if you were to buy the DVD player without wanting to use the video capability - perhaps an M33 would cost less but you would give up SACD and DVDA

With smaller (36" or less) flat panel, LCD and HDTVs coming out with enhanced features and lower price points, I do plan on getting a TV for it eventually, if I indeed do get it...but only at that $799 or lower price. (It's just a matter of time.) Meanwhile, like Neil Young says, "Because sound matters." Heh. :)

Seriously, though, if Denon was keen on selling these things, they might want to include a TV add-on bundle.

[Feisal K]

yes like an alarm clock - it could be set to switch on to a radio station or play a CD - takes some programing but easier than a VCR(!)

[nukevor]

yes like an alarm clock - it could be set to switch on to a radio station or play a CD - takes some programing but easier than a VCR(!)

By chance you have written instructions/documentation/etc. somewhere?

[Feisal K]

Denon website has a user manual for the model following - M33 manual (http://usa.denon.com/RCDM33E3.pdf) the timer is section 10

The S301 manual (http://usa.denon.com/S-301-OM_E3_IM_005_EngSpan.pdf) has this at pg 35 onwards [you'll notice it has a ON time and a OFF time this is the EVERYDAY timer function]

[nukevor]

Denon website has a user manual for the model following - M33 manual (http://usa.denon.com/RCDM33E3.pdf) the timer is section 10

The S301 manual (http://usa.denon.com/S-301-OM_E3_IM_005_EngSpan.pdf) has this at pg 35 onwards [you'll notice it has a ON time and a OFF time this is the EVERYDAY timer function]

Great information...thanks!

[nukevor]

In case people are thinking about purchasing the thing, it's best to get a build date of September 2006, as these reviews attest:

"My unit has a build date of June 2006. Denon says that the units built on or after September 2006 no longer have the "HDMI Output Problem." We'll see. If anyone is still having problems with Sept. '06 units, please comment. The build date is on the bottom of the player. Bottom line: make sure the build date on your unit is September 2006 or later."
http://reviews.cnet.com/Denon_S_301/4864-6740_7-31556197.html?ctype=msgid&messageSiteID=7&messageID=2365915&cval=2365915&tag=uolst

"When ordering, make sure you request a model manufactured after Sept 2006 and you will be very satisfied."
http://reviews.cnet.com/Denon_S_301/4864-6740_7-31556197.html?ctype=msgid&messageSiteID=7&messageID=2386082&cval=2386082&tag=uolst

[nukevor]

Denon website has a user manual for the model following - M33 manual (http://usa.denon.com/RCDM33E3.pdf) the timer is section 10

The S301 manual (http://usa.denon.com/S-301-OM_E3_IM_005_EngSpan.pdf) has this at pg 35 onwards [you'll notice it has a ON time and a OFF time this is the EVERYDAY timer function]

Well, judging from the previous few posts, it looks like this system does have an alarm clock (but its not advertised that much). Ya have to dig into the manual to find out. Basic info here:

Timer Section: The ADV-S301 has a built-in clock with three separate timer functions:

* Every: The Every timer can be set to turn the power on and off at the same time every day.
* Once: The Once timer allows you to turn the power on and off one time.
* Sleep: The Sleep timer can be set to turn the power off after a preset amount of time, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 90, or 120 minutes.

[nukevor]

From another review:

Subwoof:
"My only complaint is that it comes with a short data cable. Unless you want to have the sub near the receiver, you will need an extension cable..."

Bass:
"I wasn't getting the bass I wanted and realized that I had all 3 speakers set to the same output level. I turned the sub all the way up to 12db and the other 2 speakers to 6. This solved that issue..."

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-DZuKnJq84px/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=37700&tab=review&i=033S301#Tab

[nukevor]

Hmmm...

Amazon is not showing it as "add to cart." (same as the S-101)
http://www.amazon.com/Denon-S-301-Home-Entertainment-System/dp/B000AZB694/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-8496667-5379952?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1176098644&sr=8-1

Crutchfield says the S-301 is no longer available:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-HkA0n469jBn/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=37700&tab=detailed_info&i=033S301#Tab

Update/upgrade in the works?!:)

HDMI 1.3 would be a good starting point. The S-301 only had HDMI 1.1, as this was back in 2005...

[LeeS]

This product received a nice review from Stereophile a while back. :)

[nukevor]

This product received a nice review from Stereophile a while back. :)

Is there a review online? Tried searching, no dice.

[Feisal K]

Are we talking about the S301 still?

http://reviews.cnet.com/Denon_S_301/4505-6740_7-31556197.html
http://www.hometheatermag.com/hometheaterinabox/206denon/
http://www.devlib.org/resources/gadgets/home-theater/receivers/denon-s301-home-theater-system/details/
http://theaterathome.blogspot.com/2005/11/denon-s-301-review.html

[nukevor]

I went to a Best Buy recently and they say they no longer carry it. Interesting. I'll have to check out Magnolia (part of Best Buy) and see what the status is.

[nukevor]

I went to a Best Buy recently and they say they no longer carry it. Interesting. I'll have to check out Magnolia (part of Best Buy) and see what the status is.

[nukevor]

I went to a Best Buy recently and they say they no longer carry it. Interesting. I'll have to check out Magnolia (part of Best Buy) and see what the status is.

[nukevor]

I went to another BestBuy w/ a built in-Magnolia store today and they said the Denon S-301 was discontinued. Interesting. Even more interesting was that before it was discontinued, it was selling for $599, as the nice Best Buy employee had showed me via the inventory computer screen. (None of my local Best Buys had it showing in stock or in inventory either.)

Believable, as I saw it advertised at Fry's Electronics for $799 in mid-March. (2007).

For $599, I would consider picking one up. I'll be calling the main Magnolia number and the main Denon USA number in the next few weeks and see what I come up with. To be continued...

[nukevor]

I went to a local Fry's Electronics today and it's now selling for $614.35.

Before that, I went to a local Magnolia and they didn't have any in stock. And if they did, they could only sell an open box for $1000. Um, okay...

It might be a safe assumption that a newer version is in the works and its only a matter of time before the Denon S-301 becomes really affordable, around the exact price point of a Bose Wave Radio CD or that Polk system mentioned earlier in this thread.

I'm guessing that these things didn't sell well and it serves better as a bedroom system than a reference living room system, which is why I wanted to get this thing in the first place.

BTW, I brought in a test disc at Fry's to try it out: both a CD and SACD stereo of Cyndi Lauper's "She's So Unusual." When I put the SACD in, it recognized the disc, but no CD-text on the track listings...odd. (I thought all SACDs had CD-Text.) As with a 2.1 system it was hard to decipher the CD sound from the SACD sound, at least from a quick A-B test inside a large and noisy store. (Even a "sweet 'fake surround' spot".) But the way Fry's set up their demo units, I'm surprised that it wasn't set up 100% correctly.

I'll be bringing in a few more discs to test it out tomorrow (an HDCD, a hybrid 5.1 SACD disc, a Mofi SACD and one of my DTS discs, "Hell Freezes Over." This will be interesting.

[nukevor]

I went to another BestBuy w/ a built in-Magnolia store today and they said the Denon S-301 was discontinued. Interesting. Even more interesting was that before it was discontinued, it was selling for $599

I went to a local Fry's Electronics today and it's now selling for $614.35.

Before that, I went to a local Magnolia and they didn't have any in stock. And if they did, they could only sell an open box for $1000. Um, okay...

It might be a safe assumption that a newer version is in the works and its only a matter of time before the Denon S-301 becomes really affordable, around the exact price point of a Bose Wave Radio CD or that Polk system mentioned earlier in this thread.

I'm guessing that these things didn't sell well and it serves better as a bedroom system than a reference living room system, which is why I wanted to get this thing in the first place.

BTW, I brought in a test disc at Fry's to try it out: both a CD and SACD stereo of Cyndi Lauper's "She's So Unusual." When I put the SACD in, it recognized the disc, but no CD-text on the track listings...odd. (I thought all SACDs had CD-Text.) As with a 2.1 system it was hard to decipher the CD sound from the SACD sound, at least from a quick A-B test inside a large and noisy store. (Even a "sweet 'fake surround' spot".) But the way Fry's set up their demo units, I'm surprised that it wasn't set up 100% correctly.

I'll be bringing in a few more discs to test it out tomorrow (an HDCD, a hybrid 5.1 SACD disc, a Mofi SACD and one of my DTS discs..."Hell Freezes Over." This will be interesting.

[Gary]

Nukevor, how goes the "quest"?

[nukevor]

The quest was also a test. Went back again to Fry's and threw every type of optical disc at it, except for DVD-V, DVD-A and Dual Discs, MP3/WMA discs and Kodak Picture CDs (there was no TV attached to it).

Ease of Use, including remote control :edthumbs:
Amazingly, the test proved fruitful, especially the DTS CDs: No futzing with them at all...just push play. Kudos for Denon for simplicity. They got that part right. For some strange reason, though, no CD-Text for SACDs or CDs that have the technology, but that's a minor quibble. It's great that the receiver and the optical disc player is all one piece. Takes up less space. For those who just want to listen to music first and worry about getting a TV to watch your movies and TV later, this is the bedroom system for you.

Sound Quality and Virtual Surround :cool: but :sigh:
As for sound quality and testing the fake surround with the DTS discs and the SACDs, I'm still on the fence. From 1-10, I give it 7.5, solely on the test demo at Fry's. I also couldn't find a way to switch from CD layer to SACD layer of the same disc. If you put in a hybrid, it defaults to SACD. I figure if given more time to play with it, sound quality would rise to an 8.5 or 9.

That said, does it beat the pants of the Bose Wave Radio system and other tabletop mini systems? That's a big yes. I figure for those who get it, having to tweak it whilst reading the manual might be the only way to get it right. As expected, the Aimee Mann hybrid SACD "Lost in Space" proved to be a worthy demo disc test of this system.

Not previously owned/listened to a high-res disc player and high-res discs, it was hard to notice a difference in sound quality between redbook CDs and SACDs. For example, I noticed a slight difference in quality between the Cyndi Lauper CD and its SACD counterpart, but not by much. That might grow in time. Can you teach yourself to have bat ears? (See the "Speakers and Subwoofer" section below.)

Speakers and Subwoofer :wave:
The subwoofer is huge and decent for such a system, which is a bonus. The two left and right speakers weren't as good, as say, something like Definitive (http://www.definitivetech.com/) (aka Def Tech) but they are probably on par with Def Tech's lower-end speakers. IF there is an option to upgrade the 2 speakers (not sure at this point), that would probably be a better way to go. The subwoofer, though, is pretty much unchangeable because the subwoof plug is made only for this Denon unit. That isn't a bad thing, as the build quality is much better than the speakers. I feel the speakers would get the best bang for the buck if they could be put on speaker stands--I believe they can--instead of on the tabletop, as it makes better room for separation and (finding) the sweet spot. (Couldn't do that here with my Fry's test.)

Bass Management/Tone & Treble Control/Etc :help:
There may be something in the manual and/or remote to control this, if at all, but I couldn't futz with this much while playing the demo discs. Side two of the remote was locked so I couldn't play with this much. The only potential caveat of this review. As a comparison, years ago, I remember getting a 2.1 cube speaker + sub set up from Cambridge Soundworks (It's still in storage), which had a separate bass volume control. Not sure if this Denon has a similar set-up built-in the unit itself, but having a feature like this makes all the difference if indeed it is available.

iPod and MP3 Player Ports
No review, as I didn't get to test them. Two separate ports, one for iPod and one for MP3. From what I read from the other reviews, the Ipod compatibility is darn near close to perfect. One needs to get a TV with this, as there is on-screen menu that is almost a duplicate of the iPod's screen.

Overall Review: Build Quality, Features and Y2007 Price :D
The original price of $1599 in 2005? Forget it. Way overpriced. The mid-2007 Fry's price of $614? Worth every penny. The LED readout of this Denon could be a bit better, though the actual build quality of the base unit and speakers beats the pants of the Sony Dream System (though to its credit, has a 5.1 speaker setup and 5-disc changer, if I recall correctly.) The Denon S-301 has features that other systems don't have, like a USB port, a separate iPod and MP3 player ports (that's 2 separate ports), DVD up-conversion from standard DVDs, two-sided remote, an HDMI plug for HDTVs and support for every optical disc you can rattle off without having your non-audiophile friends' eyes glaze over.

Buy Now or Wait? :whistle:
Personally, I'm waiting, as I'm sure it will go down further in in price in the months ahead--that is if they're still available by then. eBay seems to have a whole bunch of them (http://search.ebay.com/denon-s-301_W0QQ_trksidZm37QQfromZR40QQsatitleZd enonQ20sQ2d301). The Fry's sales rep I talked to said there is a newer version coming out (I'm surprised he told me), though the way retail is nowadays, I don't believe half the things salespeople say anymore. If indeed this is the case, my wishlist for an upgrade would include CD-Text for SACDs and CDs that support them, a revised HDMI (1.3?) in & out port, a better speaker/bass management system, a better and easier-to-use alarm system, have the iPod, MP3 and USB plugs put in the back of the unit instead of the front (too clunky), a five-disc carousel tray (currently one-disc tray) and HD & satellite radio support.

If you do get this, be sure to have one manufactured with a September 2006 or later build date. (http://66.39.28.179/forums/showpost.php?p=2458351&postcount=9)

###

[redchiro]

I listened to one extensively myself once last fall. I would say it is definitely worth the 500 bucks for what you get. Overall though, I did not find the sound to my taste-I found it a bit bright at the time.

[nukevor]

Well, here's a general idea of what Denon will be up this year; here's a link to earlier 2007 CES coverage: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_14_1/show-report-ces-2007-page-49.html