DCC Van Halen

[Holy Zoo]

Although I've played this disc several times on my stereo, I finally listened through my headphones (Sennheiser HD600) last night, and then did a direct comparison to the original cd pressing (I don't have the remaster from a couple years ago).

Not surprisingly, the DCC sounds much better - a more rounded and fuller sound.

But something did surprise me - there's a very audible rumble (for lack of a better word) in between the songs. It's not your typical tape hiss, though. I actually sounds more like the inner groove rumble one sometimes hears on vinyl if you crank the volume between songs.

So, had the tape degraded over the years, or is this something that perhaps was always there (did they use a noisy console when mixing?).

Anyone venture to guess (or can Steve comment definitively?).

One last question for Steve: I noticed that most songs appear to be faded to silence *after* the songs has naturally faded out to the natural tape noise floor. Then before the next song startes, there is a fade up to the tape noise floor, then the song starts. Was there a technical reason for this? e.g. Were the songs originally mastered to several different 1/2in tapes?

thanks!

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B000002KH3.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

[ September 30, 2001: Message edited by: Holy Zoo ]

[Drew]

Actually the very first post I made in this forum about a year and a half ago was concerning the crackle in between some of the songs on DCC's VH1 and Steve's comments were that they were on the master tape. I don't think you really need good headphones to hear it either.

On the other hand, when the music actually plays I'd have to say the DCC VH1 easily blows away the original CD release that came out in the late 80's. I haven't bought the HDCD remaster of the same title so I can't compare the DCC release to that.

I have recently purchased the HDCD Diver Down & 1984 that came out about a year ago and I think the bass is considerably lacking (perhaps bordering on non-existent) and I'm not a person who bashes HDCD or any other remastering tool in general.

[Unknown]

The stuff between the songs is the sound of biased recorded tape -- no leader on that one. Steve just left it in.

Regarding DD and 1984: I don't think there's much bass from the way these were mixed. People have pointed out how bass-anemic "Panama" is in particular. I've heard that the old DD CD was cut from a really bad EQd dub, so the HDCD version is better, albeit not an audiophile delight. The bottom line is that I think you hit the upper limit on how good DD is ever going to sound pretty quick. 1984 is quite a bit better sonically, and I hope DCC gets to do this title, although I think people may still find it bass-shy unless Steve knows some good tricks.

[Unknown]

I had the same experience with the remaster of "Diver Down", and it is easily one of the worst sounding CDs I own. Very disappointing. As the owner of an originl vinyl issue, I have to say there's plenty of bass there, along with a soundstage that seems to have gone AWOL on the remaster....

[Dan]

Hmmm. I owned an original first edition CD of "Diver Down" (remember the real thin CD's with silkscreening on the entire face?)

The HDCD remaster blows the doors off of the previous version. That's all i can say.

[Drew]

I'm not saying that it doesn't blow the doors off the previous CD. I'm just saying that its not nearly the improvement I imagined. And as a matter of fact, they're some of the worst HDCD's I own. Very little dynamic range. (the japanese imported The YES Album or some of the King Crimson remasters being one of the best)

[Grant]

The DCC Gold disc and the HDCD version of the first VH album are *very* close in quality with the DCC disc having the slight edge in clarity due probably to the HDCD version being maximized for volume. But it's pretty much a tossup.

The HDCD remasters are excellent in every case. I recommend them.

[Holy Zoo]

Originally posted by Patrick M:
The stuff between the songs is the sound of biased recorded tape -- no leader on that one. Steve just left it in.


Hi Patrick,

Just ot make sure I'm following clearly: the dead silence that I'm hearing between tracks is leader tape (leader tape without magnetic particles)?

thanks!

[Holy Zoo]

Oops - you said "NOT leader tape". Sorry, I'm a dork - obviously I can't read.

Ok.. so the silence is just normal recording tape that has had nothing recorded on it, correct? Meaning: Steve didn't insert silence between songs, the silence is on the master tape.

[Steve Hoffman]

The songs had "biased" tape inserted between cuts instead of leader tape. Biased tape is just tape made with the record button pushed. No program content, just the noise and hiss, etc.

God knows why they actually did that, but they did, and I left it. Nothing else to do if I wasn't going to dump to a digital workstation....

[Unknown]

What Steve said... :)

I think the extra stuff between the songs is kind of cool. The most fitting word I could come up with is "lumpy."

[Holy Zoo]

Thanks Steve, Patrick.

Oh - I don't mind the "lumpy" sounds at all. What is kind of startling is the dead silence that happens between the "lumpy" sounding tape hiss.

If it came out like this:

end-of-song
lumpy-tape-hiss
beginning-of-song

I'd be perfectly happy.

But as it stands it's:

end-of-song
lumpy-tape-hiss
dead-silence
lumpy-tape-hiss
beginning-of-song

Ok.. I'm being way too psycho about this. Time for me to go obsess about something else :)

[ October 02, 2001: Message edited by: Holy Zoo ]

[Unknown]

I agree with you, Drew, they are awful sounding.