I got screwed on my $15,000 home theater purchase

[JohnnyK]

Boy, did I get screwed on the purchase of my new home theater system. On December 5, I purchased the following from Home Theater Designs/Big Boy Toys in Palatine, IL:

· 1 Marantz VP 12S1 projector
· 1 Aragon Stage One surround processor
· 1 Acurus 125 x 5 amp
· 2 Energy Veritas 2.4 front speakers
· 2 Energy Veritas 2.0R surround speakers
· 1 Energy Veritas 2.0C Center speaker
· 1 Energy Veritas EXL-12 subwoofer
· 1 Set of interconnect cables, phono preamp
· 1 Installation, programming and remote control system

As of January 16, all that I have received is the projector, the amp and a defective Aragon processor. Since the Veritas speakers were not in stock at the time of purchase, I was given a set of NHT VT 2.4 R/F speakers and NHT VS 2.4 surround/center speakers and a NHT SW 10 powered subwooferon a temporary basis.

I paid cash for the system. Now, before you think that I am nuts for paying cash, keep in mind that I bought my first surround system from Home Theater Designs in 1997 and I purchased a BMW Z3 from Big Boys Toys in 2000. Since I had previous good experience with Home Theater Designs/Big Boys Toys, I felt comfortable paying cash. I was told that if I paid cash for the new home theater system, I would save the 3% credit card fee.

Right around Christmas things started to get strange. The owner did not return my calls, his employees did not know where he was, etc., etc. Last week his store was empty, the fax machine was turned off, the answering machine was full and e-mail was turned off. This week I found out that he owes over $11,000 in real estate taxes.

The NHT speakers don’t sound too bad, but I want my Veritas speakers. However, I know that I’ll never get them. I could file a law suit, but the cost of the lawyer would quickly exceed the cost of the speakers (about $7,000) I am going to file a complaint with the States Attorney.
What really pisses me off is that this guy took my money knowing that he would never provide me with what I ordered. I hope he rots in Hell!

[Larry]

Ouch, I feel your pain clear over here in Ohio. I hope this works out for you down the road!

[Grant]

I never trust anyone who insists that cash be used to pay...

[JohnnyK]

Originally posted by Grant
I never trust anyone who insists that cash be used to pay...
Normally, I would never pay in advance with cash. However, in the past five years I have spent close to $50,000 at Home Theater Designs/Big Boys Toys in numerous succesful sales transactions. I have also been to the owner's house on a number of occasions. So I felt comfortable using cash.

Fooled once, shame on you, fooled twice, shame on me.
NEVER AGAIN!

[Gary Freed]

Hey Johnny,

All I can say is holy cow!!

Get to your lawyer and file in small claims if you have to.

[Jeffrey]

Hi John,

That really sucks. :(

I do not know Illinios law but in Texas you can file a claim up to $5k in small claims court without the help of an attorney for around $100. After you win, you then have to wait 10 days and you can get the Justice of the Peace to sign an abstract judgement which you then file at the County Courthouse. If the person ever attempts to sell real property in the State of Texas they must first pay you and have the abstract released in order to get title to their property. :) Check your laws because Texas attorneys will tell ya that you need their help when in reality you do not!

Good Luck,
Jeffrey

[dwmann]

I have also been to the owner's house on a number of occasions. So I felt comfortable using cash.

If I were you, I would load up all the equipment I didn't want and go to the owner's home and talk to him quietly and reasonably about the possibility of a refund. I would make SURE I was inside the front door before I said anything meaningful. Also, I would arrive unannounced with both my chauffer and my bodygaurd, who I would explain came to unload the equipment for me, and who would never say anything or make ANY type of coercive or threatening gesture, but would just happen to be two very large, mean looking chaps who looked as if they had just been released from prison. If he said he wouldn't or couldn't refund my money I would explain quietly and reasonably that I found that unacceptable, and would continue to explain quietly and reasonably that I found that unacceptable until it dawned on him that it had never occured to me he would NOT give me a refund, and that I found the idea that he MIGHT not give me a refund incomprehensible.

If he claimed not to have the funds to give me a refund, I would quietly and reasonably begin to point to items in his home that he could sell or pawn in order to raise the funds. If I saw something I liked, I would tell him how much I was willing to deduct from the amount he owed me if he gave me the item and a signed, dated receipt in lieu of cash.

If he asked me to leave I would explain that I was perfectly willing to do so, but that because we really did need to reach some sort of understanding as soon as possible, and because my busy schedule would not permit me to return any time soon, I would give him a day or two to think about it and then have my chauffer drop by with my bodygaurd to deliver the merchandise and to collect the funds, because I was sure he would realize that honesty is always the best policy.

I would not say or do ANYTHING that could be considered coercive or threatening. However, I would be SO quiet and reasonable in my discussion that he MIGHT (for a reason unknown to me - perhaps a guilty concience?) develop the idea that I'm not really as reasonable as I appear to be, and start to develop all sorts of (unwarranted) fantasies regarding what might or might not happen in the future if I was not given a refund. And if I was quiet and reasonable ENOUGH, he would probably either give me my money back or move. The imagination is a powerful thing.

:D

[Jeffrey]

Originally posted by dwmann


The imagination is a powerful thing.

:D

Hi,

Yes, it is! :D Especially, if someone thinks you are related to Tony Soprano! :)

-Jeffrey

[Mike V]

Boy, I hope you have a receipt. This guy's looking at jail time for fraud if you don't get your goods.

[Larry Johnson]

I used to be an assistant states attorney in Lake County. I would first file a police report of theft/fraud with the Palatine PD and/or try to get the state's attorney to prepare a warrant for the guy's arrest. Chances are you're not the only person ripped off by this guy, so see if you can find out the names of others in the same boat. A group of you could more easily afford the attorney to pursue the guy civilly as well, perhaps leading to the entry of a fairly quick judgment and lien against his house.

[cunningham]

This is happening to several home theater companies. The market has dropped and they are going under. I suspect the guy might be filing for bankruptcy, which may reduce your chances big time. would get to him asap, face to face and deal. He will not be able to get your stuff, maybe give you stuff he already has.

[JohnnyK]

Originally posted by Larry Johnson
I used to be an assistant states attorney in Lake County. I would first file a police report of theft/fraud with the Palatine PD and/or try to get the state's attorney to prepare a warrant for the guy's arrest. Chances are you're not the only person ripped off by this guy, so see if you can find out the names of others in the same boat. A group of you could more easily afford the attorney to pursue the guy civilly as well, perhaps leading to the entry of a fairly quick judgment and lien against his house.

I plan on submitting a complaint ti the Illinois Attorney General. I am also filing a law suit in small claims court. The settlement is limited to $5,000, but that is better than nothing.

[Michael]

What a shame. I feel sorry for you. I wish you well. Do everything in your power to find this guy! There are people out there who will help you.
Good Luck!

[BradOlson]

Good luck. I'd be very skeptical of this deal if I were buying that system. I'm glad I bought a more modest system. I would not even want to think about being screwed with this kind of deal.

[Jeffrey]

Originally posted by cunningham
I suspect the guy might be filing for bankruptcy, which may reduce your chances big time.

Hi,

Hmmmm..... this is a very good point! In Texas (and probably Illinois), the minute this guy files for personal or business BK your collections efforts are done! No more small claims court or other civil efforts are allowed.

Go.... Go, Johnny, Go..... oh, Go...... :)

-Jeffrey

[RetroSmith]

If this were Brooklyn, This guy would get a visit from two guys named Carmine and Nunzio..........

[FabFourFan]

Originally posted by cunningham
This is happening to several home theater companies. The market has dropped and they are going under.

Well, not around here, it seems!
HT retailing and installation is about the only part of the hifi business that appears viable these days...

FFF

[Todd Fredericks]

Hey, Johnny, I'm so sorry this happened to you. I hope everything works out.

Todd

[JohnnyK]

What makes me so upset about this whole situation is that I spent months listening to different brands of speakers. I really loved the way the Veritas speakers sounded. They made cymbals sound absolutely real. First you felt the impact of the stick against the metal, then you heard the "ping", finally you heard the ring. The NHT speakers are okay, but they lack the realistic sound of the Veritas.

This A**hole took all the pleasure out of purchasing a completely new audio system. I ask, how often in your lifetime do you have such an opportunity?

[Ronflugelguy]

Originally posted by JohnnyK
What makes me so upset about this whole situation is that I spent months listening to different brands of speakers. I really loved the way the Veritas speakers sounded. They made cymbals sound absolutely real. First you felt the impact of the stick against the metal, then you heard the "ping", finally you heard the ring. The NHT speakers are okay, but they lack the realistic sound of the Veritas.

This A**hole took all the pleasure out of purchasing a completely new audio system. I ask, how often in your lifetime do you have such an opportunity?


Never often enough!:(

[JohnG]

A damn shame. Especially galling since it was a trusted friend in the business.
Hope you can get some sort of reimbursement.

[Gary]

Wow, this really sucks. :(

Have you tried to contact this guy at his home yet?

Forget about reimbursement - or even small claims. You'll just be crediter # 237 or something. Try to get those speakers, man!

[KLM]

I was reading your post and truly feel bad for you. One idea came to me that you might want to try (although I have no idea what results you may get). Assuming you have a receipt and the dealer was authorized to sell you the gear, have you tried contacting the manufacturer directly? Again, don't know what they can or will do but at worst they may be able to provide you the product you want at wholesale.

What do you have to lose?

[GabeG]

Originally posted by KLM
I was reading your post and truly feel bad for you. One idea came to me that you might want to try (although I have no idea what results you may get). Assuming you have a receipt and the dealer was authorized to sell you the gear, have you tried contacting the manufacturer directly? Again, don't know what they can or will do but at worst they may be able to provide you the product you want at wholesale.

What do you have to lose?


It's worth a try, but I'd be the reason the dealer didn't get the speakers in the first place is that he owed the manufacturer money. Unless Veritas is an amazingly generous (and liquid) company, I'd doubt they'd lose money twice on the "dealer". Wholesale would be nice and appropriate though.

- Gabe

[Joseph]

Originally posted by GabeG



It's worth a try, but I'd be the reason the dealer didn't get the speakers in the first place is that he owed the manufacturer money. Unless Veritas is an amazingly generous (and liquid) company, I'd doubt they'd lose money twice on the "dealer". Wholesale would be nice and appropriate though.

- Gabe

Here's API's website (Veritas). I have found them to be excellent (an generous) in their past dealings with me. Good luck.

http://www.energy-speakers.com/